Encoded for the Experiencing War web site for the Veterans History Project.
The recording of the interview with Margaret Grissinger was digitized.
This transcription was encoded with minimal changes to the original text in an effort to preserve original content and idiosyncrasies of the person interviewed. Period language and terminology are also retained. Encoding is literal with regard to the transcriptionist's capitalization, punctuation, and spelling. Spelling errors are indicated with [sic]; however, recurring errors in spelling within a single document have been marked the first time and not subsequently.
Which war are you a veteran of?
A veteran of the first Gulf War in '91 and the war on terror.
The war on terror?
The war right now, the war between Iraq and Mghanistan.
Weren't you also a veteran ofVietnam.?
I am a late veteran of Vietnam. I went in late 1973. The draft stopped in '74 - '75. The women actually didn't go pretty much any where near Vietnam except the hospitals and ships or if they were nurses at the time.
All right. Did you support going into the war? I guess the main war that you were involved in?
Yeah, the first Gulf War.
Did you support us going to war or did you support going into it?
I never really gave it that much thought. It was just that, (you know), this evil man invaded another other country and he needed to be stopped and at the time I think, and still to this day, everybody considers America of the 9111, the go to guys to clean up their messes. Whether I supported it or not, it was something that wearing a uniform you just, you did!
I think I'm going to learn an awful lot about you.
(HaHa). Maybe
Ok.
How old were you when you went off into the war?
When I went to the first Gulf War, I think I was thirty four or thirty five, yeah, thirty four or thirty five.
When you enlisted?
When I went .... my original enlistment was in '73, I was eighteen. It was two days after my eighteenth birthday. It was like broken service, it was the kind of thing where I did my five years. I went to college. I stayed in the reserves and then when I graduated, I fmally got my Bachelor's degree, and I got commissioned, as a nurse, and then went back on active duty. I was thirty three when I got commissioned and I was ... I think I was a JG when I went over there, so I was probably thirty five. Thirty five yeah.
When you went, when you were eighteen and you went into the service, you went into the navy, you ... we were at war at Vietnam too?
Yeah, we were at war with Vietnam, but how did anybody feel about the Vietnam War? You know, it tore this country apart in a lot of ways. We still didn't treat those veterans very well in my opinion, although I think a lot of them, some of them would shoot me for saying this, I think a lot of them exaggerate what it was, but I also think that there was a major differellce between the Vietnam era veterans and World War II vets, in that we won World War II basically and we came home from Vietnam and we really hadn't won anything, and just the mode of transportation and it's been studied, that you know, putting those guys on troop ships and bringing them home, they had time to decompress, and to get through some of the things that post traumatic stress syndrome, and those kind of things. Where as the way that we brought them home from Vietnam, was that we stuck them on a plane and the next thing you know you are in California or Hawaii; and they really never had a chance to decompress. This is just my opinion, conjecture but .... what I think.
Yeah, I can see your point. ..
So, the next question is, were under the legal age to fight, but you weren't actually ...
I was eighteen and I was a girl and it was a different time. Girls. You have to remember when I was in the navy girls still weren't allowed to go into the naval academy, or any of the service academies. So it was before any of those equal rights laws were passed, and so a girl, actually at the time my father had to give consent for me to go into the navy at eighteen.
Did anything specifically spur you on to join the service at the time of war?
I don't think I gave the war much thought when I went and joined. I think, like I said, we were pretty much on our way out of Vietnam. At the time, again like I said, women just didn't do that sought of thing. So I never felt for any fear for my safety or anything like that. I joined the service because I needed to grow up and try to get an education.
and pay? Go ahead.
I so, I think there was a little bit of service involved with that. I thought that it is an honor to serve your country, I believe.
Yeah
Let's see. I guess we will see what it was like and since you are basically involved in two different wars, it says (reading from a list of questions) what was the atmosphere like during the, umh, what was the atmosphere during the war like? So when you were in Desert.
Well when, I was actually in Desert Storm, there was umh well there was a lot of camaraderie and a lot of watching out for each other, a lot of making sure that everyone stays safe. There was some Tom-foolery going on, you know. You had as much of a good time as you could in a war zone. There is also some fear because he was lobbing those scud missiles at us. I had to put my gas mask on more than once and the mob gear, and the whole nine yards. It was 130 degrees in Saudi Arabia, it was a Labor Day weekend, and they didn't want the women to take the blast part of their uniform offbecause they were so worried about offending the Saudis. That didn't last very long, so there is a lit bit of irritation in there. Here we are defending ... how can you defend your country and you know don't even consider the fact that it is 130 degrees outside and we are not used to this. We lived in tents. Am I going off the subject?
go ahead
I would say there was good bit of camaraderie. You know watching out for one another. Making sure you had plenty of water to drink, and that kind of thing because I mean it was hot! That was lIlY biggest gripe about the whole thing because it was hot!!
So the next question is, "was it crazy"? How was it?
Urn. I don't know, yeah, it was crazy, calm, probably a little of both. Depending on the conditions.
What kind of things were people doing when the war was on?
Well we had to set up a hospital. We were a 500 bed field hospital, so, you had to get all that stuff together. So you had to work together and make sure everything was set up and it was staffed basically, what it was, we were on a 24 acre compound and we weren't allowed off the compound for the first gosh I think it was 90 days before they let us off the compound and that we knew there was anything outside the gates of the compound. Umb, there was a lot of work going on, a lot of physical work going on.
Did the key people do anything strange or violent or act differently?
I didn't know because if they acted differently, I didn't see a whole lot of violence towards each other. I don't know if they acted differently because these were a group of people that I didn't know any of them, and I didn't know how they acted before, so to say that they acted differently, I can't answer to that. They were, like I said before, they were supportive of each other. You watched each others back. You know, you made sure that everyone was OK in your little world, in your little tent world or whatever.
That was actually when you were over there in Saudi Arabia.
What was the atmosphere like? Was there a different, I guess, I imagine there was a different atmosphere during Vietnam, right or during .... ?
Well I mean, like I felt when I came back, I mean I felt like we were heroes, or people thought we were heroes, or people were proud of us and glad to have us home. You're always glad to see your servicemen come home, but they treated us with, I think, a different respect than the guys coming back from Vietnam, only because I read this in history books, and read it in newspapers, and read it in things like that, not that I ever lived any of that Vietnam experience first hand. The Gulf War we came back and we were heroes. People appreciated what we did. There were flags waving and yellow ribbons and everybody was glad to see us home, and glad that it was over. Often wonder, why we didn't finish him off in the first place
What about as we were going into this war? Actually you were still active then.
Well. People will say what they want to say about George Bush and the political ramifications, but the man did what needed to be done. Had something, and this is my opinion, and my opinion only, had something been done when the Cole was bombed, maybe the World Trade Center would still be standing. We let that go unpunished in my perception and after the World Trade Center was bombed what choice did we have but to try to track him down. I realize that we haven't found him yet, but you had to get rid of that insurgency. As far as that Iraq thing is concerned, given the information that the man had at the time, saying he had weapons of mass destruction, he was right and I know he had weapons of mass destruction, cause I had them lobbed at me, they threw scud missiles at us, and him, Saddam, not cooperating with the United Nations, not letting them in to do the inspections, and that kind of thing and granted I realize what came out in the end was that there were no weapons of mass destruction found, but who is to say, they can still be buried out there for all we know. I mean, so were we justified in going in? Given the information that we had at the time ...
Ok, let's see. What was your family's reaction to you going into the war?
My two. I think they were adolescent or pre-adolescent, I don't know, anyway, two young girls left to live with their grandmother, oh my god how awful was that for them, right? They were scared for me.
How about your mom?
My mom never said. She was happy to have me home, but she never said. The girls were scared for me. They were afraid that I wasn't going to come home the way I left. Maybe I didn't, huh? Ha Ha Ha Ha.
How about your brothers and sisters? Did they ... what was their reaction?
Well they were very supportive, and you know they sent care packages. Everybody was very good. Care packages came. Letters came from people like, you know, a cousin's kid who I hadn't even ever met. You know, Johnny Long's kids sent me, his whole class sent me letters, and umh, you know, there seemed to be a lot of support on the home front, and I'm sure everyone was worried, and I'm sure people were concerned.
Yes, I can remember watching it, and I know that it was one of those where we had much hope watching the news and listening to the radio.
Was there any disagreement with your family over, you know ....
No
.... having you going into the service?
Oh my father ... my mother had a cow initially when I went in, when I was eighteen. She just had a cow. Girls just don't do that yada yada yada ... whatever. My father was more supportive and in the end I did what I was going to do. I was eighteen
It didn't cause any problems, so your mother became supportive?
Um, in the end.
How did your life change? Did your life change?
Oh my life changed tremendously, I mean I was good to this country, but this country in return was good back to me. I mean God, I have a masters degree that I probably wouldn't have ever gotten. Who knows? Who is to say?
That was a direct result of you going over there?
Well, I don't know that it was a reward for going over, but it certainly was something that was given to me. I mean I earned it, but the choice was given to go to graduate school, so.
Then they came back for you?
Yeab, that is when I went, after the Gulf War.
Was it like this for everyone?
I don't think. I'm sure there are people out there that say that they have Gulf War syndrome. Umh, I don't know what that is, so I can't address it., but I was over there for almost seven months.
Did it make you, that experience going over there, did it make you stronger person?
Isn't that what they say, that what doesn't kill you makes you stronger. Pretty much you get a headache for over three days because there is no coffee. You know, Ha Ha. It makes you stronger.
Would your be life, would your life be different, if you hadn't gone over to Desert Storm?
I don't know. I don't know. My life would be different if! hadn't gone in the service, but would that specific end point Desert Storm. I don't know.
Would you have your masters degree?
I could or I couldn't. I mean it is a competitive process where you put in your application and you apply, but
How were you registered into the war? You weren't drafted?
No. No. There was no draft. I enlisted and ...
Well they weren't ...
The draft was no, the draft was pretty much over even in '73. I mean they ... nobody in my class out of 500 got drafted to go to Vietnam. Our numbers, maybe their numbers were lower.
They weren't drafting women either?
And they still don't draft women. They don't draft women, so.
Oh, tell me about your boot camp experience? Your training experience, what kind of training did you have?
Well, in boot camp ... was thirty five years ago. I really can't tell you. I forgot.
Where did you learn to make a bed?
To make a bed, so I could bounce a quarter. Yeah a lot of good that does anybody. That is just a whole discipline problem process and a discipline to follow orders and whole kind ofumh, what is the word I'm looking for, maybe even a brain wash to a certain kind of degree, but not in any bad regard, but more in you need to learn to get along, to follow orders, to think but not think too much, and then when you go to OIS, it's just a different thing. You know, you learn how to put a uniform on , which I already knew how to do, so there was a whole big lot oflearning going on up there. What was the other part of the question?
Tell me about boot camp experience, or training experience?
And then, I mean you got like maybe an hour's worth of training about Saudis and their customs and Islam and stuff like that, and since I have had more since then, but initially it was, you know, don't speak to them unless they speak to you, kind of thing, but there was, you know, the whole male female hierarchal
I can see how that would be a big issue.
So you didn't have to do drills?
Oh yeah. I had to learn how to march and you had to learn how to polish your shoes, you had to do all that stuff, you know, that goes right. You know, you had to learn how to do that, you had to learn how to wear a uniform how to learn, how to look right in a uniform, march. I mean drill with weapons, after the World Trade Center, umh, I got attached to group of army guys and was urn, attached to them and had to learn for the fist time in my entire career, I had to learn how to shoot a weapon, and that kind of thing. That was something I just never did before.
They didn't do that in boot camp?
No not when I went to boot camp, but they do now, but not when I went.
What about for the women?
You were part of a big transition
Yeah
Umh, so as far as when you went over to the Gulf War, the only kind oftraining that you got, that was the minimum training that you got, you actually got?
No. I mean when I went over to the Gulf, we were. The thing that the medical department is that, not so much you are a non combatant, basically. So you have Marines protecting to you. Thank God. So you are pretty much a non combatant. We didn't carry side arms, or do any of that other stuff, especially in the navy.
Were you pretty worried about what you would see?
As far as ... yeah, definitely destruction to the human being, yes the thought crossed my mind but it is not something we dwell on.
It is something that in the medical field you ...
Yeah, just being a nurse today. Just being in the midst, you see some much of it.
The next question is how long were you there?
Seven months
and umh how strict was it over there?
Very. It was very strict. It was ridiculously strict because we were in Saudi Arabia and umh because that whole Islamic culture, umh and because we were women. You know, the Saudis hire Europeans and other westerns to come to do their work and they live in special compounds separated out from the rest of the Saudi culture, and this is how we were treated. The same kind of way. As not me personally, but us as a group.
So there was no difference between you being a woman and the next guy being, you know, male, it was just that you guys were treated differently because you were poor.
For westerners and I'm sure had gone out in society in Saudi Arabia, yes there would have been a difference because it has come up since then. You had to dress like Saudi women, kind of thing. They didn't want to see women driving. They didn't want to see women running around with their heads exposed. They didn't want to see this and they didn't want to see that.
Did you ever leave the compound?
Oh yeah, but never. I mean I went to Obi Gabi, which was in Emeritus for a big, for like four days and then, umb, eventually they let us out of the 24 acres and there was a place to go buy a hamburger and get Baskins and Robbins ice cream and mail your stuff , and things like that so ..
Oh, well what branch did you serve in?
The navy.
You were in the navy. Oh, what was it that made you decided on the navy?
I think: my cousin Mickey went in there first. because I guess I was hoping that I would hook up with him and he would protect me for the rest of my life.
Oh, you were in the medical field, but it says (looking at the questions) what kind of weapons did you use?
Just a revolver. Just a side arm when they finally did let me. They, ha ha, they never did trust me to shoot a machine gun or anything. They took me out once on the range with the machine gun and they said, no Meggie, you can't have that. They did give me a side arm. They did teach me how to use a side arm.
And did you have to carry the side arm?
When I was with the army guys, I did. Yeah, otherwise no.
When you were in the camp?
When ... this we are talking about after 911?
Yeah
When and I was stationed out in Puerto Rico, and there was an army unit down there and they attached the nurse and the anestiticians surgeons to them. So when I was attached with them, yes I wore it. When I was working at the hospital, no I didn't have it.
Yeah, it was kind of ...
Yeah, not necessary
To actually have it?
Oh huh, I might actually shoot my own foot off.
Oh yeah, did you agree or disagree with the equipment that you were to use?
No. I didn't disagree at all. It was a necessary evil.
So you carried a side arm when you were in Puerto Rico?
When I was with the army guys.
Part of that unit. When I went back to my own unit, no. When I was out on liberty, no, but when I was working with those army guys on their compound, doing what we did, doing what they do, yes I had a weapon.
Umb, this question, did you capture anybody.
Did you see anybody captured.
No, I heard stories, but no, no verification.
How involved were you? Do you wish you were more involved with the war, or less involved? Do you wish there was more you could have done?
Yeah, by the time .... the first one, the first Gulf War, I mean I was off on a Friday sleeping, I get a phone call. The morale to that story is that you don't answer your phone on your day off, because the next thing you know I was going to Saudi Arabia. I mean it happened that fast. Umb
How much time did you have?
A weekend. It was a Friday and I was gone by Sunday.
Umh, the next time, for the wnh, for the War on Terror, it was, you know, I mean you're the nurse left standing, so you are going. You weren't really given a choice. Didn't give it much of a thought, kind of glad I didn't have to go anywhere to be perfectly honest. Umh, but you got to do what you have to do
Umh, were you satisfied with what you accomplished in the war, with your part in the war?
Yeah sometimes I wished I could have done more, but there wasn't a whole lot more to do, so yeah I was satisfied with what I accomplished.
That you were a part of it?
Yes apart of it. That I got to help a little bit, you know, help get these guys back together again and wnh, and grateful that it wasn't anything worse than what it was, from my end of it.
What about the War on Terror? Weren't you on a ship during ... ?
No, I was on a ship prior to that. I was on a ship prior to 911. I had come off the ship before 911. When 911 happened, I was stationed out in Puerto Rico.
Ob, here is a good one for you (looking at the list of questions), where did you travel while in the service?
Ob, ha ha ha. I did two west packs.
What is a west pack?
A west pack is when you go out to sea, and you go on the western Pacific and you, and everybody goes to the Middle East, and then you basically patrol in the Pacific ocean and you come out, and then you come home and it takes six months. Now I think the deployments are longer for people, but normal deployments are six months. So, when I was, when I did two west packs, so I was on what you call amphibious assault ships. So you have about 2000 marines that the whole sole purpose of these ships is to get these marines to the battle zone, and this is what you are training for the whole time. So you are carrying 2000 marines to the battle zone, whatever it is, and along the way we got to stop in Hawaii, and Singapore. We got to stop at Singapore a couple of times, and then I was in Hong Kong for New Years Eve, umb, went to Thailand, and then you go into the Middle East, and then when you are in the Middle East, you just basically are patrolling up and down in and out of the Red Sea, in and out of the Persian Gulf. We used to call it do gates work. You are kind of floating around in the water making sure everything is OK. Every once in a while you float into Bahrain, which is actually pretty nice place. It is more western. It is where all the Saudis go to have their drinks on Friday. And umb, Arab Emiratis, and then went to Jordon, and when we were in Jordon, that had to be a lot of chatter about bin Laden because it was the second west pack. It was in Jordon, in Acka Ba, and we were off loading the marines. And they were suppose to go to do an exercise with the Jordanian army and within 24 hours we had to backload and we were in Pac K wan delta which is a pretty serious threat con. We had to have ... , we were enclosed inside the skin of the ship. We weren't allowed outside the skin of the ship, and wnh that was kind of scary because at the time I wasn't reading message traffic, so I really didn't know what was going on exactly and umh, it was really kind of scary, but once we got I guess kind of far away or the threat subsided, we umh, opened up the skin of the ship again and it was more life as normal, and again this is still all prior to 911.
Ok, so this is all prior to 911, so there is alL .. you know that there was traffic and chatter going on. Yeah, yeah. Oh and I have been to Africa for like ten seconds to catch a plane. Not fun ha, ha. Australia, one of the most beautiful places in the world.
So what was your favorite place and what was your worst place you have been?
Australia was my favorite and Thailand was the absolute worst.
Why Thailand?
Thailand is just the sex trade in Thailand is disgusting!!! It's is just disgusting!!! It's, and I'm no prude, but it is no place for a white woman and then somebody said Megan and it's no place for a Thai woman either, and they are absolutely right. Prostitution is rampant, child prostitution is rampant, it's just the worst place, and the food sucks. I don't care what people says
Ha, ha, ha
The thing I liked about Australia, it's green. You can drink the water. There is so much to be said for running water and flush toilets, that ... I mean the whole basis for civilization. I mean there is no diseases, or lost disease, not none but, and the people were absolutely glad to see the yanks, and it was like, they were still enough people I guess alive from World War n, that remember the Battle of the Coral Sea, and they know, had it not been for the American navy in War World II, they would have been speaking Japanese. So there is still a lot of that respect there and the people are overtly friendly, and it wasn't just about the American dollar, they were just friendly unlike other places like then, where it was all about the American dollar.
Umh, were there any other family members in the war?
Umh, now there are?
Yeah, now there are. Also two cousins.
Anything you want to add?
No. Good luck on your project.
This is. I think he has got it.
What would you say if one of your kids wanted to go?
I would prefer that they graduate from college first and got commissioned before they went. I don't think that I would want to send a .. , because I had girls too. I don't think I would want them to enlist. I think that I would prefer that they were degreed and able to get a commissioned before I let them go.
Would that be the advice that you gave to Kelly?
I think I did. I told her to fInish nursing school, because at the time she was going to nursing school and talking about it, and I told her to fInish nursing school.
Yeah
Because it is a better lifestyle. It truly it is. I had nothing against being enlisted. I had a great time. It was, you know, but it is a better lifestyle to be an officer. It truly is.
Ok. Thank you.