Encoded for the Experiencing War web site for the Veterans History Project.
The recording of the interview with William T. Dunbar was digitized.
This transcription was encoded with minimal changes to the original text in an effort to preserve original content and idiosyncrasies of the person interviewed. Period language and terminology are also retained. Encoding is literal with regard to the transcriptionist's capitalization, punctuation, and spelling. Spelling errors are indicated with [sic]; however, recurring errors in spelling within a single document have been marked the first time and not subsequently.
Today's date is November 10, 2017, and we are at the Iowa Judicial Branch Building in Des Moines, Iowa, and we are with the National Court Reporter's Foundation and the Iowa Court Reporter's Association. I'm joined by Videographer Chris Wallace and court reporter Jeanne Jacobs, our interviewee and Veteran William Dunbar and his wife Sharon Dunbar and I am Sara Maniscalco Robinson conducting the interview. The purpose of this interview is to get your perspective on your time in the service. Let's go to the question page. Mr. Dunbar, could you please give me your full name.
William Taylor Dunbar, III.
And your date of birth.
[birth date redacted].
Branches of service.
Marine Corps, Air Force and Army.
Your highest rank attained.
Staff sergeant.
Your years of service.
23.
And which major war or conflict did you serve in?
Well, I feel like I served during the Vietnam conflict but that's--
So what year did you get and what year did you get out? Spanning what years?
In the beginning I went in in 1957 and retired about 1982 or '83.
Your career spans several decades? Let's start at the easiest place to start, your childhood. The beginning. Where and when were you born?
I was born in Dallas, Texas in 1939.
What's your birth date again?
[birth date redacted].
How about your parents? What are their names and what did they do for a living?
My father was William Taylor Dunbar, II or Jr., and my mother was Lorretta Rutton (ph), they called her Letta, and one was born in Oklahoma and the other was born in Arkansas. My dad was Arkansas and my mother in Oklahoma.
What did they do when you were young?
When I was young I was born in Dallas, Texas, my dad was working for a sewing machine company and traveling around Arkansas, Oklahoma, and Texas selling and repairing sewing machines and he had worked on planes and flown mail for the postal service and my mother was waiting tables.
Yeah. So, do you have any siblings?
No, I am an only child.
So, what was-- if you could tell me in a few sentences, what was your childhood like growing up?
Growing up, my mom and dad packed us up and started moving around. That was shortly after the hard times, the Depression, and everything and they traveled different places. Lived in different places in Texas and they were crossing the desert and heading for California and work in the airplane factories, a lot of plane factories were firing up and they thought that was a good place, so they had headed for San Diego, California, and my grandmother and my mother's sister also moved out there because they were on hard times. They were living on a farm and they moved out there and my dad got-- all he could find was selling newspapers on the street corner and my mother was waiting tables and so, you know, that was a time when they started the Second World War and it was different for everybody. My dad didn't think he was going to get drafted but he was working on an assembly line on one of the aircrafts and between waiting tables and taking care of me, I was fairly young at that time but we stayed and lived there and my dad was drafted. He didn't think he was going to get drafted because he had a child but he was sent over anyway's and it was overseas during the invasion of Japan and my mom was working on the assembly line because there weren't enough men to work and she was Rosie Riveter and I went through grade school there and my dad came back and the War does strange things to you and my mom and dad separated and he went back to Dallas and out there with his folks and they eventually divorced and my mom and I-- my mom was trying to take care of me and then she had another child and I have a sister and-- it was nice in San Diego, you had the zoo and living by the sea. This was a nice life. It wasn't that tough of a life growing up. I joined the Marine Corps and lied about my age and went in at 16 and my mother had signed for me, not knowing-- because she was an alcoholic, she had become an alcoholic by that time and I went in the Marines and spent two years in and got fed up with driving a tank and I went with a buddy and he talked me into going into the Air Force.
Let me ask you one quick question before we go into that, Billie. What made you interested in the Marines? Why did you go into there?
My uncle was in the Marine Corps and he was in to some of the island fights and he was wounded and I was very proud, that was the aunt that came, she married him and they-- so I liked everything Marine and so I figured, well, I'll give it a try and I didn't mind it but it seemed like going in -- it changed into something else -- would be better.
What year did you get into the Marines?
In 1956.
So, let's talk a little bit about your Marine time before we go on to the Air Force time. I know you say you didn't like it, what things did you enjoy about the Marines?
I was right there in the Marine training facility and it was kind of -- put my uniform on and I was in high school at that time and I just-- the camaraderie and everything else. I thought it was neat because the uniforms were neat and everything, so, basically it was a fantasy of every young man to be able to do something like that.
What was your job in the Marines?
I was a tank driver.
See, now that's a job you can get behind. What kind of specialized training did you get for that job?
Really, not much. We would go out and go from the MCRD which was the Marine training boot camp and Pendleton where the regular Marine station was and we go up and do maneuvers off the coast, landing barges and everything and going-- taking our tank and shooting at targets -- practice and everything. It was interesting.
So what kind of places did you serve while you were in the Marines?
Pardon me?
Where were you stationed?
I was stationed between Camp Pendleton and Oceanside, California, and also at the Marine recruit depo in San Diego.
How long did you serve as a Marine?
Two years.
Tell me about the story about what happened next?
I was just getting into my senior year and I was running around with seniors and my best friend, he came to me and he says you're about ready-- are you going to re-up in the Marines and I said yeah. Well, don't do that because the Air Force says they can put us through as buddies, they call it the buddy system, you go in and you stay together and go into the same job and everything and Paul was his name and Paul, are you sure-- what are we going to do. How about air police and I said, yeah, that sounds good to me. We went to the recruiter and signed up and then we were sent up to a base around San Francisco and he had been in the Army Guard and I was in the Marines, so we didn't have to go through basic training or anything again. We got us uniforms and gave us a test to find out what kind of job we were going to have and ended up he got air police okay, but I was going to work on jet aircraft, brand new-- jets were just getting into things and a jet mechanic. I wasn't a mechanical guy but apparently that's what they thought was good for me to do.
What jets were those that you were a mechanic for?
They had F-100's, the F-100 and also they had the Shooting Star which was one -- they also became training planes later on when they get in advanced aircraft. I worked on B-47 while I was in the Air Force and B-52, F-105's-- those were getting into the newer into the '60's.
So you said you weren't inherently mechanical. How did you learn to do this job?
They sent us to jet aircraft school in Amarillo, Texas, they had a base where they taught you all about the jets and how to build them and how to put them together and all the things it takes to get them off the ground.
So they gave you proper training?
Yeah, we-- graduated from jet school with flying colors.
What was your time in the Air Force like? What did you do?
I did quite a bit. I went to Germany, they sent me after-- I went to aircraft school, I went to Germany and I was stationed at Landstuhl, Germany, and that was the Air Force Base in Germany and I was put on the T-33 which was a trainer plane and then went to the more advanced planes and also worked on propeller planes, they were kind of phasing out. When I went over, I went on a propeller airplane and that was a long trip over. Then the F-86's were one of the planes that I worked on over in Germany and it was interesting, they still had German civilians that would come on and work on the planes with us and it was kind of interesting, we would pick up a little German and-- that's what I did for quite a while and-- actually all the time I was in Germany was working on the aircrafts. While I was there, I got married and I was 18 years old, married and then I had a daughter and we lived on the economy for a while and shopped-- my time came up and then they shipped me back to the States.
Did your wife and child come back to the States with you?
Not right away, they came back afterwards.
When you came back to the States, where were you stationed?
I was stationed in the lovely frozen tundra of Duluth, Minnesota.
So what was your job when you went to Duluth, Minnesota?
I was still a jet mechanic and working on 105's, jet fighters and repairing them and launching them and that's what I did-- I was there for probably a year and a half and then I got a hardship transfer because my mother-- I mentioned being an alcoholic -- was not in good health and they were having problems-- in the meantime when-- just before I went to Germany, she had a daughter and so I got a hardship transfer back to Riverside, California, the Air Force Base there and I went there and I worked on-- I worked the B-47's and also on the T-33's again.
So you are stationed in California to help care for your ailing mother?
Well, it would be close and try to-- there was a lot of things going on with my sister too, so --
Do you remember about what year that was?
That was about 1962 or 3.
So where was your next station then?
After Riverside, I changed skills.
You got a new AFSC.
I went to refrigeration and air conditioning school, went to Shepherd Air Force Base and learned all about refrigeration-- I thought -- they sent me to a missile base after that, they trained me on missile cooling and repair and so, I went through school and my wife and I by then we had another little girl and we got through school and they sent me to a New Jersey missile base, a BOMARC missile spot there, just outside of a little town on the coast in New Jersey and Toms River. We were out in the sticks, there was a lot of places to hide with the missiles and I ran and operated and took care of these big chiller cooling systems that pump -- the missiles had to stay cool and their fuel had to stay cool and so we provided that and then-- that was during the Cuban -- and we were on alert a lot, so that's--
Is that what we know as the Cuban Missile Crises?
Yes. I was about two years I was there and that was when everything was heating up in Southeast Asia and I got orders to go to Nam then and so I packed up my family and moved to San Diego where my mother and sister and my aunt and uncles were there, I thought it would be the best place for them to be while I was over there and I flew over there and it was-- that was in '67.
'67?
'67, and they diverted me to the Philippines and it was a big buildup of troops during that time and they had-- there was to me it was like thousands of troops coming in on planes every day and and they put me-- there was so many people coming in I stayed in the gym on base. They put up bunks in the gym until-- they couldn't find anywhere for me to go and so and then I found out after about a month or so I was going to stay there, instead of go to Nam which was-- it was okay.
Do you remember which island you were on in the Philippines?
It was just about 80 miles or so from Manila, it was a main island and Clark was about an hour or so from Manila but they assigned me to civil engineering group there and so--
What was your job in the Philippines then?
Officially I was refrigeration, air conditioning and cooling and everything else and I did that for several months. They finally got me into a barracks, which wasn't real better-- most of the barracks were quonset huts and the showers were out in the middle but I was there about two months and they finally got me-- they did have some big buildings, you know, for the guys--
More like real barracks?
Real barracks, the brick and mortar building, finally it was after three or four months and they were still coming in, still coming in and I was working in the shops for a while working on various pieces of equipment and everything and we would fly out and pick up equipment because it was only an hour flight from Siagon to Clark Air Force Base in the Philippines and we would pick them up in C-130's and take them back and we also have troops going back to the hospital because that's where the main support was at Clark for the hospital and we also brought back body bags and-- I would voluntary sometimes-- the hospital was over crowded and nurses, doctors, and those weren't really bad -- the ships were of tin and wooden quonsets -- They would go and set up there and some of the other things that I did, I got working with American Force Radio and Television and I got on there and doing shows and on the radio, worked on the radio. We do an all-night shift and broadcasting to the troops around-- all over the Philippines and the sailors in Olongapo and Manila and Singapore Bay.
You were the Cronauer of the Philippines?
Right, even better yet, it was good-- nice part of that, there was a Philippine radio station outside in the town, outside of Clark Air Force Base and I go-- went down to and talked to the manager and say, you know, I have all of these records-- LP's at that time and it's all rock and roll because the base station couldn't play rock and roll. That was the big thing that they got into it in Siagon because they couldn't play anything but waltzes and orchestras and country music, which was good too, because I like country music, but that was the big -- why Cronauer got in trouble because he would play what he wasn't suppose to be playing.
So did you get to play your rock and roll LP's on the night shift?
No, not on base, that's why I went downtown and did a three-hour show, nothing but rock and roll and the station there had a hook up with a station in Manila and you could hear it clear across the ocean where the sailors -- I got letters from the sailors and the troops that were on the coast, the coast had enough that the signal out in Manilla was getting there.
Do you remember your call numbers and--
I went by Billie D, because I couldn't say Sergeant William T. Dunbar or Sergeant Dunbar, it was like KES--
AM or FM?
AM.
I imagine it was AM.
Yeah, it was AM. That was a fun time because basically-- we had an NCO Club there and they could play rock and roll in the clubs and I come in, everybody knew me, so--
Let me ask you this, Billie, why did you do that?
Why did I do that?
Why did you voluntary your time to pretty much entertain--
Because I think it would have helped especially hearing the music that they would have been hearing from the States and-- but, also it was radio and television but we had television locally in the base. I was their Santa Clause when I was there-- I was there two years. Went to this orphanage where they took children from their parents because they had leprosy and they take all the kids, the orphans -- sorry.
Take your time, if you need to get a drink.
And I get to give these kids something they didn't have--
That was real special.
After that, about the time-- well, my wife came over and she was there a few months but things weren't right, so my commander sent her back and I finished out the rest of the time at the Philippines and then I was assigned to Offutt Air Force Base.
One question about Philippines, how did you stay in contact while you were gone?
Well, we could make calls, there was calls that we could make.
Like a MARS Station?
Yes and letters. Just before I left Clark I was working-- we had so many troops coming in we would check them in and give them what they can do and what they couldn't do. Well when I got there, you couldn't go off base after 8:00 and so you had to brief them coming in and out, coming back, I really-- this is just something that gripes me is that there was veterans and the nurses and doctors and the veterans were stationed at Clark and Thailand and Cambodia in the '90's they cut off any contact with being part of-- being a Vietnam Vet because they cut off allowing them to join the VFW and that left a lot of people over there who saw this and did the same thing I did and I don't think that's fair. It's the only gripe I have about my service in the military. I came back and I got out--
How long were you in the Philippines?
Two years.
Two years at Clark?
At Clark and then in that area, we would fly in and out and--
In and out of where?
Out of Siagon and other bases and just pick up equipment and C-130's and--
When you guys did pick up remains, did you do official military remains transfer with the flag folding and everything?
No not there, they would take them to the mortuary at Clark.
The mortuary was at the Clark Air Force Base?
Yes and when-- I went to Offutt in Omaha and was working on big chillers for the underground.
Was that your next station after you were at the Philippines, Offutt?
Yes.
What was it like coming back to the world?
A lot different.
What kind of things really stick out in your mind as--
Well, of course the War was still going on but-- it was kind of nice to be-- to be out of that situation. I got out of the Air Force and took a break and then I went into the Army and-- where I was until 1982, '83.
Why did you get out of the Air Force?
Because I went through a divorce and I just-- between what I had carried over from overseas and because of my breakup --
Do you remember what year that was?
That was 19-- it was probably around '71, '72.
So right at the tail end of Vietnam. What did you do then?
I went to Hollywood. I went to Los Angeles and got a job. I did-- I was an insurance salesman, I did movies, I did radio, I did some more work in radio. I went to a radio school there too and then I went-- they had an American Forces Radio in Iowa, so I joined back up in the Army and finished up my 23 years and retired from the Army and then I went back and started working at radio stations in Omaha, Nebraska.
Talk a little bit about your Army time because I'm very interested in this Army time. So tell me what your official job was in the Army.
My official-- well, mostly broadcast and community affairs--
Public affairs?
Public affairs.
Did you go out to Fort Meade, Maryland, for your training?
Yeah, for a little while and I got mostly in Omaha and I came back to Omaha and I was in Idaho and also California there.
What drew you to join the Army and to be a broadcaster enlisting in the Army?
A change. It was kind of-- it was in my realm of doing things, it was comfortable
How long were you in the Army for?
About seven years more after that.
What was your rank when you retired from the Army?
Staff Sergeant.
So you were an E-6?
Yes.
Let's talk a little bit about what your-- what you enjoyed about your time in service over all.
Probably when I was young and went to Europe and see the world. It was like getting an education that you didn't get in school and, I mean, you couldn't pay for it. See different countries, France, Germany, Denmark, Switzerland, Greece, Berlin. At the same time when the Berlin barricade was in and you could only go down so far and if you are flying through, the only way you get into Berlin is fly through this little corridor otherwise the Russians would shoot the plane down and how-- not very many people get a chance to see the world and things like that and here I was, you know, 17, 18 years old and I've seen the world. That was to me -- you can't pay for that.
How do you think your experience in the service has made you into who you are today?
I don't think-- I really don't think I would be where I am now if it hadn't been for the military. You can't pay for that.
How about -- did you learn any big life lessons in the military?
It wasn't always like it is. If you get out and you see other different ways of life -- I traveled around when I was in the Philippines various places like -- when I first got there, you weren't suppose to go anywhere outside that area, the Bays. I did. I had a houseboy that took me out to just below a volcano that is not there anymore and Clark Air Force Base isn't there practically anymore because it erupted and took that all away and I wasn't suppose to be where I was because there were Filipino Communists up in the volcano fighting, you know, -- there was communists there too, which a lot of people don't realize. They were called the Huks and I was at the village and eating what they were eating and also hearing the guns as they were trying to take over with-- that's things you don't always run into.
How did your time in service from a 16 year old Marine to go get the bad guys -- what did you learn about war, being a part of it and what would you tell that 16 year old about what he's getting into?
To me, it was an experience for me and I would say, you know, -- they have to make their own decision. To me it was a good decision and in some ways, my personal life and everything was a mess but my military work wasn't.
How about the ideals of what's the difference between the idea of war and the actual experiencing it?
As talking to a lot of my VFW and American Legion troops, it's not like, you know, you see in the movies. It's not all John Wayne and it's just-- and a lot of times it's a love of your country.
Did you ever have the opportunity to appreciate it while you were there, how beautiful the different areas of the world can be that are not necessarily ravished with war? It was a beautiful country.
I don't know how to answer that.
I know some guys they could actually appreciate the beauty of the Triple Canopy regardless of the situation of why they were there, to realize it's a beautiful part of the world.
It is, it is. I was in the jungles of the Philippines and it's beautiful. I mean and things that you would never experience unless you've been there.
What message would you like to leave for future generations who hear this interview?
Give it a lot of thought, look in your heart, think of what you might find that really stirs your--
Passion.
Passions, yes, for your country and your buddies.
Would you do it all again?
In a heartbeat.
All right. I think we are to our last question, if you are ready. Is there anything that I did not ask you about that you wanted to talk to me about?
Oh, again, I touch on this thing about what they're losing in the VFW for not giving back those that they are turned away that served in Southeast Asia during the Vietnam Conflict. They are still there, they are losing out.
Give me one second to make sure that I did ask everything. I have one quick question that is Vietnam-generation related. When you came back from the Philippines to Omaha, what did you see in the general population and their opinions of Vietnam and how did that affect you?
Came back, landed at the Airport in San Francisco, they were at that point in time transporting troops back on civilian aircraft -- you may have heard this quite a bit -- walk across the tarmac and there were people at the gates, fences, spitting at you, calling you names, because we had to wear our uniforms at that time -- and there are a lot of guys that still carry that around. It wasn't them.
How do you feel about our current generation and how well they are respected especially how we are teaching our youth to respect Veterans on Veterans Day now? How do you see a change from the '60's until now?
I think there is a difference. They are doing a hard job, a real job, and I think everybody shows that and respects it now. I hope that's the way it is. I try to reflect that on to the new troops out there that are coming back. I have a son that he came back pretty messed up but I respect him for what he did.
I think that's about it. How much time do I have left? You have ten minutes if you want to tell me about your son a little bit. We still have ten minutes.
He's Army, he was Army. He was in the first Gulf War and he was carrying ammunition in Iraq and bringing prisoners back and he came back and he got out and then he went back in again, so it was pretty good, but he brought back a lot of baggage and he's still having problems and I hate to see it and it's caused some problems in the family because of it but his step-mother takes care of him. That's about it
Okay. Do I have to say anything at the end of the interview for the Library of Congress? It looks like that's it. I don't see anything that I have to say. Thank you. (The interview concluded at 11:47 a.m.)