>> From the Library of Congress in Washington, D.C. >> Tom Smith: How are you doing? I'm Tom Smith, is this on? Is it working? I'm Tom Smith. I'm a volunteer at the Veteran's History Project. I've interviewed right around 250 World War II veterans for the project in the last 3 years and [inaudible] in case you haven't guessed or haven't checked your phone this is the Interviewing Techniques Panel, but occasionally I will have a person who comes up to me and asks me how do you do these oral history interviews and really the short answer is ask the question and just get out of the way. >> Dave Winkler: Okay, my name is Dave Winkler. I am with the Naval Historical Foundation, which is located here in the naval yard. I've been doing oral history with the foundation since '97. We have a volunteer organization about 75 folks around the country for collecting oral histories and they send them to us and then we register these interviews with the Library of Congress Oral History Program. I've also done quite a few oral histories as part of that program and also a lot of oral histories on the app of the Library of Congress [inaudible] Project. Also I'm a Commander of the Naval Reserves so the Navy calls me up from time to time and sends me out to the ship to interview folks about what's going on out there and we also interview senior naval officials. So, that's my background with oral history. Brian? >> Brian Williams: I'm Brian Williams, and I'm the historian with the American Red Cross, and I've been doing a lot of interviews with our people not only the ones that served during World War II, which there are quite a number left, but also other lines of service. My first experience doing oral history was in 1960s, and I interviewed my grandmother who probably the most important thing in her life in the 1906 San Francisco earthquake and fire, which she lived through. She was a young woman at the time. And so I got that family story and just a few weeks ago as a matter of fact I made copies of this and shared with other members of the family and, of course, my grandmother is long dead, but her voice and her intonation and her stories come back life on the tape and it's really a remarkable experience. So I have had a long turn and deeply felt appreciation for doing oral history. I'm glad to see that it's catching on. >> Frederick Rawlins: My name is Frederick Rawlins [phonetic]. I am a volunteer for AARP and I'm working with the AARP [inaudible] as coordinator of the Veteran's History Project [inaudible]. I have been with the program for approximately a year and a half now. As you probably know or maybe don't know, AARP is one of the founding organizations for this project and [inaudible]. I have, I have been involved with history even prior to my association with this particular project. I have been interviewing veterans because prior, during my working years - I have now retired -- during my working years I was with the Veteran's Administration as a Veteran's Benefit Counselor and a Veteran's Assistance Counselor and, of course, in that position I interviewed veterans to determine what they needed, what benefits they weren't receiving and that, of course, sparked my interest in working with veterans. So, it's just natural for me to get involved in the Veteran's History Project. So that is my background. >> Tom Smith: Actually the first submission that I bring to the Veteran's History Project is not an interview at all. I was very fortunate that my father had decided 45 years ago to sit down by himself and just record tapes of his memories of the Second World War and he actually said on those tapes that he could not have done that if I was present. So I think one of the difficult things maybe for some people is that they want to interview a family member to maybe sit down with their father or mother and get them to talk. Anybody have any tips on how to get them if they're reluctant? Well, you're right it's very difficult to work with your parents. I found what makes an excellent interview submitted to the foundation done by grandkids. For some reason there's a bond between grandson and grandpa or granddaughter and grandma or grandpa or whatever that seems to work [inaudible] interviews that way. The other thing is you mentioned do it yourself. We have a do it yourself memoir kit that we have on our website and we get quite a few interesting memoirs that way. Brian? >> Brian Williams: I don't think there's any one answer. Some families son or daughter can be very comfortable dealing with parents. I know at a certain stage in my life when [inaudible] interview my dad because we spent a lot of time arguing with each other, but I think that depends on the individuals, but I will say this my brother is a history professor out in Northern Kentucky and for many years now he has worked into his course work a project for his students to go out and interview their grandparents particularly life in that region which is relatively depressed during the Depression and such. These young people come back and they're just growing with interest and appreciation for their grandparents and they'll say things like I never knew what life was like and what they went through. So it's an incredible bonding experience that my brother has done [inaudible] students and their grandparents. >> Tom Smith: My family [inaudible] too because I've done oral history interviews with certain veterans and then some of the schools will send students around and the veteran will say, well, should I do this because I've already sent it to the Library of Congress, and I think really they should do it for the betterment of the student because the student talking with the veteran first hand is getting such valuable information and even if that is not the same information that I got when I sat down with the veteran, some of it might be different than what I got and it's definitely been a valuable lesson. >> Frederick Rawlins: I think that when you're attempting to interview members of the family particularly the older members it takes patience because there are a lot for memories that they have that they have, well, certainly have forgotten or maybe repressed and things that they don't really want to talk about, have not talked about for a long time. So, you have to be very patient with them, but I found it valuable to just be alert and when you're having normal conversations things come up that they didn't realize that they were going to talk about, but you take advantage of that opportunity to really press ahead and you can get information that way. >> Tom Smith: And that would be rule number 1 if you're going to go out and do these oral histories whether with a family member or anybody else give yourselves plenty of time, take along plenty of tape, whatever format you're using, and be patient because there may be long periods, I've had veterans shut off the tape recorder for a little while to think. Just give yourself a lot of time and the other thing about these oral history interviews is some people are, some of the veterans I've talked to have been intimidated by the idea that they're doing an interview and that's not really what these are in the oral history aspect of this thing. You really want the person to talk about their life. And I have done this, I've asked a guy maybe one question, where were you living in 1941? And he's talked for 45 minutes. That's not a problem at all. As long as he's talking about the war years because that's what we're doing here with this project then that will work out just fine. >> Dave Winkler: Yeah, one thing following that is to open an interview you want to, before you do the interview you want to establish a rapport with the individual. You want to do something to break the ice. You want to find a common bond. Now in my case because I have military service, there's a common bond right there, but it doesn't necessarily have to be that case. For example, if you're a daughter and you don't have military service but your father has military service, you can play that up, you know, find areas where you have a commonality. Maybe you root for the same baseball team or maybe you went to the same college or went to the same place. What I usually do I like to go do interviews in the individual's home or office because what I then do is I'll do the office or home scan where I'll look around the room and see some interesting things. I did an interview with Secretary of Veteran's Affairs Principi, and I saw a Dallas Cowboy's helmet on his desk, and I'm thinking this guy went to the Naval Academy, Dallas Cowboys, Roger Staubach. So I opened my interview saying so you went to the Naval Academy. That's right. And did you play on the football team? He says that's right with Roger Staubach, and he just opened up, you know, because there was that common bond. So you need to put the interviewee at ease with something that individual is comfortable with and then the interview will flow nicely. >> Brian Williams: I suggest that we think about it 3 or 4 points that are really important for conducting oral histories, and I jotted some down. The first one that I recommend is really prepare carefully for your interview and that means not only touching, making contact with the person you're going to interview as Dave says, but also become really familiar with the subject. I would be insulting people who fought in World War II if the terms and the campaigns and the years just were all sort of mush in my head. I need to know the sequence of events and the importance of them and so forth. So preparation is a tremendously important part of doing a good oral history and that means not only studying it but also making contact with the person in advance. I always talk either visit with or extensive telephone conversations with the person I'm going to interview. So we're already friends when the interview starts. The second thing is listening. That really, you know, you go around and see all these people on their cell phones and are they really listening or is that even just talking to each other? Well, listening is kind of a forgotten art, but it's terribly important in oral histories. I've had the same experience started in oral history and I haven't said a word for 30, 40 minutes as the person just pours forth the history of their life. So listening is very important. Appreciating. You have to show appreciation. Sometimes if an oral history is successful, people are really bringing forth important aspects of their lives, and I know we have all had this experience. I've become quite used to it now when people break down and cry. You've touched a memory, a vital memory from their past and so you really have to show a real appreciation and create a very positive mood. >> Tom Smith: And that listening aspect is very important because you can go in there, you definitely should at least look over a list of questions that you should ask in these oral histories. You can find them in the Veteran's History Project kit, but really listen to what the person is saying because something probably will come up during their conversation that will trigger probably a more interesting question because it will be more specific to their experiences. >> Frederick Rawlins: You touched on a lot of things. The points that you made are extremely important. First of all preparation. The way I think I prepare is by knowing something about the individual's background. That is if I am lucky enough to have some information on him or her before I walk into the interview, but certainly the more information you have concerning and individual the more, the better the interview is going to go, but I think one of the most important things, two of the most important things as you said are listening, listen to the individual as he or she is talking because they are bringing out points that you may not even be aware that's in their background. So you have to be prepared to respond to that. The other thing, which I think is most important is being sensitive to the individual's emotional involvement in the story because things are going to come up that will cause the individual to probably stop, teas will come to their eyes and you have to be prepared to wait and let them gather themselves again. The stories that you hear are stories that the individual have wanted to share for years and rather than call it an interview I refer to it as the veteran's story, and I usually begin by saying this is your story, and I let the veteran tell it in his or her own way and as you say step back and let them talk. >> Tom Smith: Also don't be intimidated. There's been a lot of talk up here about preparation. Usually before I go into an interview, and I've done a lot of these, all I know is the branch of the service the guy is in and where he served and then I go in and do it. Now the benefit that I have is that I have been paying very close attention to World War II history since I was old enough to realize my father was in World War II. So I do I mean I've been watching the TV, reading the books and all that stuff all my life long before I ever started doing this. So, if a veteran does tell me he served in the Battle of the Bulge or something like that, I know exactly when that happened, I know the sequence of events there and I have a rough idea of what he went through although we try to get specific in the oral history, but really I mean this is just the way I do it. I like it to be as fresh and spontaneous as possible. So I go in there with a certain series of questions that I want to ask the guy, but I really don't prepare that much. >> Dave Winkler: Yes, do you think they have oral questions for us? >> Tom Smith: Yes, that might be a wonderful idea. If anybody has any questions about how to do these oral histories. >> Frederick Rawlins: The mic is coming to you. >> A question about the tools of the trade. Do you generally always use a tape recorder or are you, you know, scribbling notes the whole time? >> Frederick Rawlins: Could you repeat that? I couldn't hear at all. >> I'm sorry. Is it safe to assume that you're always using a tape recorder in these interviews or is like sort of an initial interview? >> Frederick Rawlins: Yeah, you have, you know, the way we do it we use either an audio recorder or a video recorder or both. So, the individual is aware that they are being videotaped and also there's an audio tape that is running. We use the audio tape because it's easier to transcribe from an audio tape than it is from a video tape. So, yeah, we use both mediums. >> Is there sometimes a problem with the subject not being comfortable being recorded? >> Brian Williams: Sometimes it comes up, but I can't, I can't recall an occasion when someone has refused to do an interview because it was going to be recorded because that has all been covered in the negotiation beforehand. There are times when I have arrived with a video camera and the person was expecting me just to come with a tape, audio recorder and that has caused a little bit of apprehension or hesitation, but everyone seems to comply. I don't know whether it's just my charming personality or not but it's always worked out so it's not really been an issue. >> Tom Smith: And it is nice to do these things on video to get the people on video, but all of my, mine are exclusively audio. My background is radio so I'm just more comfortable plus I do what you mentioned I go to the veteran's home and that makes them a lot more comfortable, but also I am more self-contained, it's easier for me to haul my equipment around, and I know, I definitely know there are times when I've got more candid responses from the veteran because they're just sitting there and they've kind of forgotten about the microphone in front of them as opposed to having a camera staring down at them, but, you know, most of these veterans get copies of the tape so they certainly know what they had to say. Any other questions? >> When dealing with family members, we have the luxury of being able to talk to them for extended periods of time, they're very comfortable with us, but my question is do you feel that if you do sort of a pre-interview with them you lose spontaneity? Or do you recommend doing some sort of pre-interview to know roughly where the interview will go and the types of subjects and to even give us the opportunity to perhaps go and do a little bit of our own research on that so that we can ask more interesting questions? >> Tom Smith: Definitely. If you think you might not be familiar with the area like I say if you find out a little bit about where they served but you're not familiar then you maybe want to ask some questions about that in advance. I prefer the more spontaneous because I do know all that stuff so I do it the more spontaneous interview, but preparation certainly doesn't hurt. >> Dave Winkler: Yeah, an opportunity to, I've had quite a few interviews where I'll sit down with an individual for lunch beforehand or just to get to know the individual just to build that rapport because then we go into the interview I think that person will be much more comfortable with you and will be more spontaneous and a little bit more trusting, you know, sharing those little secrets with you. So, I do think it's not a bad idea to sit down with the individual, you know, and do a nice this is, you know, talk about some of the things you're going to cover. >> Frederick Rawlins: Yeah, that's true, but I think it depends on how the veteran comes to you for an interview and when I say come to you was he referred by someone, did he or she come on their own accord? Or did family members encourage them to come? I have been in situations where the veteran comes to the interview and he says, well, I'm here because my son and my daughter told me to come now interview me and that's not a, I mean that's not a good way to begin an interview. So, what you do is to just start chatting for a while until he or she becomes, gets to realize that it is his story, his interview and even son and daughter told him to come there, he has wanted to tell the story himself for a long time. So then it becomes a real good and spontaneous interview. >> Tom Smith: However, I would add that we have been doing this interviews here for the Veteran's History Project, these oral histories, and we don't know anything about the person other than say hi, what branch of the service were you in and then we sit down and start talking to them. Fortunately, we've all done this enough and we've heard enough that we know how to ask for questions to start to get the story and then just take it from there, but I know I sat down earlier with a gentleman for 1 hour and I got really lucky because he was very talkative and a very good storyteller and he just, he went, and I'm pretty sure we got everything down that he wanted to get on the video tape. And the other fortunate part is his family members were also there and so they would nudge me and say ask him about this. So they were very specific questions, but they got it all on video tape. Any other questions? >> Frederick Rawlins: I just wanted to follow up on something that Tom said when the family members are in the room sometimes it's wise not to let the family members in the room with you, but be nice. But if they are in the room, you tell them just please sit quietly because this is the veteran's story. It is not the wife's story, it is not the son's story, it is the veteran's story, but when the family member is there and the veteran is having difficulty, it's good for the family member to sort of jog his memory. So it's not all bad having the family in the room. >> What are some key questions that you should ask to get the conversation going? >> Frederick Rawlins: Okay, a key question. First of all determine what and where the veteran was in service, what branch of service he was in, when he entered the service why he entered the service and then you go on to his duty stations. Those are key questions and then you find out what was probably the most memorable experience that he had during his military service. >> Tom Smith: And usually the veteran will take you in the direction that he wants to go. If he, like we were saying a lot of the guys or women have things that they really have wanted to tell so once you get past the general questions of all of this information, they will give you a good idea of what they want to talk about. >> Dave Winkler: There are markers in history when I'm dealing with World War II veterans, where were you on December 7? That's a great question because everybody remembers where they were, if they were alive, on December 7. Just like our generation knows where they were on 9/11. So that's a good question. Another question is, okay, why did you join the Navy in my case? And what brought you in? The first day of boot camp. Everybody remembers the first day at boot camp as if it were yesterday so that's a great question. Reporting aboard your ship for the first time. You see this gray ship or the other services reporting aboard your platoon, what were your first impressions? Who met you? Who greeted you? Talk a little bit about the individuals you served with, you know, talk about the chief, you know, in the Navy or your sergeant in the Army. What was the skipper like? And then, of course, you go into the different actions they talk about. Of course, where were you when Roosevelt died is a very good question for the World War II generation. They all remember where they were when they heard that. Of course, when they, when the bomb was dropped, what was your reaction to that? So, those are very good questions for the World War II generation. There are similar questions for like Korea, Vietnam and the Gulf War where were you when the war started type things. >> Brian Williams: Yeah, I agree this is all excellent advice. Two points I'd add. One is a good question to start out with is to ask someone where they were born and raised and education and that has 2 purposes. One to sort of put everything that follows into context, but it also gets them talking about something that doesn't require very much reminisce. We all know where we were born and raised and so it's an easy way to lead into the interview and to go back to your question before I was surprised when I started doing them on video I thought people would be kind of apprehensive and whatnot. Once they got launched into the interview, the technical aspect of things just seemed to evaporate. They just ignore the camera. It's really remarkable. And one other point one question that I find quite useful is to ask someone to tell me about how a typical day would go in their work and I always when I say that I always am reminded I had the opportunity to do a number of interviews with John Glenn, and I covered not his space story as much as I did his war stories, and I asked him that question about his being a fighter pilot during the Korean War, and he told the day from beginning to end that I will never forget and the way he put in context being up in the air up by the Yalu River with migs above him and just painted that picture it was incredible, absolutely incredible and that all came from just a simple question tell me, you know, you take off in the morning and what happens? So, that's a good question and one other question I sometimes ask people is if you had a day in your life in my case in the Red Cross let's say to live over again, what would that day be? And that has produced some sort of miraculous results too as people think of one day that was really joyous or very meaningful to them. >> Tom Smith: If you mention that to [inaudible] and that is usually one of the first questions I will also ask and it, sometimes you get really, really good detailed stories about December 7. Other times you don't but it definitely takes them back there and start thinking about that time and it really starts it rolling. >> Two questions. When, if you are or the veteran says well why do you want my story? How do you answer that? And my other question do you limit the time or amount of information that veteran, I know you don't want to wear out, you know, the veteran and just keep going and going and all of a sudden they're asleep or something like that. What do you recommend? >> Tom Smith: As far as the Library of Congress is concerned, they say they only want 90 minutes. I've cheated a few times. They say they only want 90 minutes maximum but I have talked to veterans for 3 hours or more and give the Library the best 90 minutes. So, like I say give yourself plenty of time because there may be something they'll say in the second or third hour that you wish you had. So give yourself plenty of time. >> Frederick Rawlins: I think that it is very unlikely that the veteran will tire of the interview or will go to sleep because once he gets into the story, he begins to relive it and he becomes alive again. So, I don't think that that is a problem, but again you have to be sensitive to that and if you think that the veteran is tiring, then maybe it's time to bring it to a close, but I don't think that that is going to be much of a problem. >> Brian Williams: Frankly the bigger problem from time to time is the interviewer getting sleepy. [Laughter] >> Tom Smith: And did you also ask about when a veteran says he doesn't think his story is important? [ Inaudible ] Well, and you can only do so much, but you definitely have to convince them that their story is part of history all these little pieces are important, but there are some veterans that I know I've come across with really interesting stories that simply won't talk, won't go on record. You can't do anything about it. >> Dave Winkler: One thing I get calls almost weekly sometimes daily from children and grandchildren of veterans who died 20, 30 years ago and they're asking questions about ships, they're asking questions about duty stations. They want to know something about grandpa. Where was grandpa? And I'm able to provide a lot of material sometimes pictures, histories of ships, and that kind of brings the grandchild with the, connects with the grandfather who has been long deceased. And I pass that on to the grandfathers who are still alive and I say hey, you know, this is an opportunity because some day your grandkid may want to know about what you did during the war. Maybe he or she doesn't care right now, but they will and you'll have this story on hand at a location such as the Library of Congress, it doesn't get any better than that really, where they can access this, and I think that's kind of neat. >> Tom Smith: Any other questions? >> That brings up the question about what will be the fate of these tapes? Is anybody planning on transcribing them because tapes will eventually melt away and how do you access the tapes once they are in the Library of Congress? >> Dave Winkler: Get a little closer. We didn't hear that one. >> She wanted to know -- >> -- what will be the history of the tapes that you make? Are you going to have them transcribed? They will melt away as tapes eventually. Are they going to be cross indexed? What will you do with them at the Library of Congress? >> Tom Smith: Well, I don't do anything. I'm a volunteer I'm out there in the field. The Library of Congress as I know it they put these tapes in the archive. They are going through the process of making transcriptions of these tapes and that is a very lengthy process. We've got someone who will tell us all about this. This is Peter Bartis [phonetic] from the Library of Congress. >> Peter Bartis: In answer to the question about the tapes, the National Association of Court Reporters has volunteered to transcribe all of the tapes over time and they will be digitized and preserved at the Library of Congress and available to the public for all to see and here at the American Folklife Center's Reading Room. Of course it'll take time to organize all of this, and we continue to do it as they come in, but happily we have a backlog, which is very good. >> Tom Smith: That's all? [Laughter] We'll get you a microphone, and you look very familiar. [Laughter] >> Okay, now have you ever encountered a situation where the person whom you are interviewing seems to be embellishing the story and if you suspect that, how do you deal with it? >> Frederick Rawlins: In answer to your question, yes. [Laughter] Yeah, that, it happens that the veteran is embellishing his story because that's the way he wants to remember it. And there's very little you can do about that unless he goes really too far afield and then you can probably just start another question to start him on another track, but as long as he doesn't get too far, get too outlandish, then just let him talk himself out. Anybody else want to respond to that? >> Dave Winkler: I don't worry too much about that because as a historian what I do is I used to be a navigator when I was at sea, and when you're a navigator what you do to get a good fix is you get 3 lines of bearing, okay. So if somebody says something in an interview I usually from my writing history I try and get a cross check, another line of bearing from another interviewee or another or like an official record, and if they check out then I use it the history book that I'm writing. If not, then I, if it kind of seems fishy, I might not, you know, use it so. >> Tom Smith: And I have found that when they realize they're doing this for the Library of Congress they don't do a whole lot of embellishing, and I've never crossed, come across anyone who said he shot Hitler or anything like that. So, I think most of the guys that I have talked to have been very honest and they realize how serious this is and they want to get their story down right. So I really haven't had a problem with anybody doing any of that. >> Frederick Rawlins: Just to that I just want to make a point to following up on the question that was asked there. I was interviewing a veteran and he kept making reference to a young girl that he had to meet when he got out of the service and, of course, I thought this was a girlfriend of his, but as he was telling the story it turned out that it was not a girlfriend but it was actually a young girl and it was the daughter of a veteran, a buddy of his, and it seems that they were, this veteran and another veteran and his buddy were in the POW camp and the camp was, am I still on? Okay, and the Germans were saying that they were going to close the camp and they were going to relocate the veterans to another location. The veteran's buddy had left home while his wife was pregnant and he was really wanting to get back to see his new child. Unfortunately, he did not get back but the veteran was going to do that for him so he wanted to get back to the United States and he wanted to see this girl so that he could tell her, okay, this is better, so that he could tell her what her father was like. So when he made reference to the girl he wanted to get back to, he was talking about the daughter of his buddy. So, what may sound outlandish to begin with, maybe it is not. >> I just wanted to ask a question if you all are taking interviews and you're gathering everyone else's history, it's a history in and of itself of what you're doing. Is anyone capturing that and are you sharing your experiences of what you're doing? Because that's a lost art and it doesn't need to be lost. If you don't do it yourself, then you're not giving someone else the opportunity to learn and the next generation won't know how to come behind you and do it. >> Tom Smith: I do have a reporter who is in the Cleveland area who has been real nice about doing stories about what I'm doing periodically so she's helping certainly. Anybody else? >> Dave Winkler: Well, this is an opportunity to put on another hat. I'm vice president of an organization called OHMAR, which is the Oral History Mid-Atlantic Region. There are oral history associations throughout the country up in New England, Michigan, down in Texas Southwest Oral History Association, and they have web pages and they have annual conferences and they have workshops. For example, the OHMAR oral history workshop is going to be this upcoming October here at the Library of Congress. Brian is going to be doing an excellent workshop on video. So there are opportunities for you to get involved with these associations. Of course the Oral History Association, which is the national organization, of course there's a Folklife Association that also deals with this type of stuff also. So that's one way that we keep this profession going. >> Tom Smith: Any other questions? >> Yes, I'm curious whether or not you've had occasion to interview someone multiple times? And, if so, what was the outcome as you perceive it? >> Tom Smith: Multiple times as in continuing interview or? >> More than one sitting. >> Tom Smith: More than one sitting. Well, I'm still not done talking to Venus Ramey if that helps you at all. >> Brian Williams: Yeah, I have, and the whole design of the project was different because I had in one case 16 interview sessions with one person and so we move very, very incrementally through that person's life. Typically my interviews are about 2 hours in length. We talked about time a little earlier and 2 hours is just about as long as you can go and be fresh, and I'll say this I didn't anticipate this when I started doing oral history it is exhausting. If you're doing a good job and if you are actively listening, it wears you out and so after 2 hours, on occasion I've done 2 hours in the morning and 2 hours in the afternoon and I'm wiped at the end of the day. Absolutely. So. >> Tom Smith: And you're a better man. I cannot do 2 of these in 1 day. >> Brian Williams: I don't ever want to do it but occasionally you have to. >> Tom Smith: Exactly. Any other questions? >> Yes, I was wondering if you could touch on group interviews? You talk about speaking with individuals. Do you do group interviews? >> Tom Smith: Particular interviews that we've done? >> No, group interviews? >> Tom Smith: Group interviews as in having a group of veterans sit around and talk? >> Exactly. >> Tom Smith: That had been suggested, and I have done a few of those things informally. The problem is then you do get a little more embellishing when you've got 3 veterans sitting around BSing and that sort of thing. If that's the only way to do it, do it. I mean I think you'd get a much more personal story, you get a lot more detail if you can sit down with people individually. Anybody else try that? >> Brian Williams: Well, there are pro and cons because sometimes in exchange among people bring out a lot of interesting information and sometimes you can get a sense of kind of the character of a unit or a group who have worked together, but I guess I recommend basically to do one-on-ones. You probably get more information in the end. Another interesting thing is sometimes people will defer to one another and so like if you have a, I'm not good on military terms here, but if you have a boss man and workers and you're trying to get the whole story about what it was like to be both a boss and a worker, the workers will tend to defer to the boss and so you're not getting the whole story. It's a kind of complicated answer, but I found that to be true. >> Dave Winkler: Yeah, and just one technical thing is if you have a group interview and it's going to be transcribed, if you have individuals with the same sounding voice you need to work something in where they are identified otherwise you don't know who is talking. That's just something, you know, a technicality you've got to work into. I've done group interviews with pilots unfortunately half the time they're talking with their hands like this and, you know, that doesn't translate very well on audio tape. So that's another consideration. >> Tom Smith: Any other questions? >> We have one over here. >> Yeah, I have a comment that maybe you can respond to. I spent some time going to ship's reunions with my dad and talking to the veterans before I ever heard of the Veteran's History Project, and one of the things that I come away with is that the enlisted men seem to have a different story than the officers and having known a lot of the stories they will not go on the record even when they could literally rewrite the history of a battle, mistakes that were made, et cetera. So I don't find embellishing I find talking to people just talking to them you get a lot of very interesting historical information but trying to get veteran's to go on the record when there are instances for lack of a better word mistakes, incompetence, screw ups, they will not, they will not go on the record against an officer of a ship and my brother who is a military officer or was at the time would say try to document, you know, these things with these guys because they could literally rewrite a battle, and I've checked and looked up the official record of the ship's logs, the after action reports, read official naval accounts and none of these things are in the official record. I also went out to Pearl Harbor for the 60th reunion and listened to accredited historians talk about what happens at a battle, and I called up a few guys who were there and said is this the case? They said no. So you find, you know, if you're lucky, folks who were there and who know will talk, but most of my experiences off the record they'll tell you what really happened and it's a very interesting, for somebody who is interested in history as I am, it's a very interesting dilemma or situation. So, I just wanted to make a comment because so much talk was done about embellishing that my experience is the opposite and it's absolutely fascinating . >> Tom Smith: And that's definitely true. You can't make someone talk about something they won't talk about period, but I've definitely had people hint at officers doing the wrong things, and I have had at least a few occasions where a veteran would specifically say Library of Congress I want you to know this guy's name and he put it on tape, but then, of course, he signs a release afterwards. So. >> Frederick Rawlins: I just wanted to respond to that as well. That is one of the more valuable aspects of this program. We have heard the official version of the war, we've heard the official version of incidents. We hear what general so and so says, but to really get the actual true picture of what happened day by day you get it from the individuals who are out there in the fox hole, who is out there facing the enemy face to face and the person who says why do you want my story? That's why we want your story to tell it like it is. >> Dave Winkler: Yeah, I have a comment that basically the way history was written and presented through the 1960s was the great white man's view of history whereas it was all, the American history was a history of American leaders and at that time was mostly white males so you had histories of, you know, admirals and generals and presidents and there was very little history of like working folks, the folks who were out there doing the job day to day. Part of the 60s and 70s there came this new history coming up and what I like to say history from the [inaudible] up and where you had these programs such as the Library of Congress Veteran's History Program outreaching to the folks who actually did the jobs day-to-day, they peeled the potatoes, they fired the guns and we're a much richer society because of that because the history that is being written today based on some of these oral histories are much, much more realistic and accurate and give a much better portrayal of, you know, of what happened during these, you know, calamitous times in our history. >> Tom Smith: So if you do decide to do this if you want to talk to a family member or you want to go out in the community and grab a lot of veterans like I have done, the Veteran's History Project it's available, you can go to their website, they'll give you a list of questions, they'll really walk you through it so that we can talk to anybody and really do. The important thing is turn on a mic and let them -- >> -- this has been a presentation of the Library of Congress. Visit us at loc.gov.