>> From the Library of
Congress in Washington D.C.
>> John Cole: Good morning and
welcome to the Library of Congress.
I'm John Cole.
I'm the director of the Center for
the Book in the Library of Congress,
which also has the
privilege of being the home
of the Young Readers Center
at the Library of Congress,
which is joining us in
sponsoring today's symposium
on the reluctant reader.
We're very happy to
have such a turn out.
I want to talk a little bit at the
beginning about what we're up to
and also how we're
going to proceed today.
We're going to have 4 experts.
You're going to hear from and have
a chance to question on the aspects
of the topic of the
reluctant reader.
I will introduce them and they
will each make a roughly a
5-minute statement.
And then we'll open it up for
questions and we hope to end
around 11:30 to have a book
signing out in the foyer outside
of the Mumford Room
where we are today.
I'd like to say a quick word
about the Center for the Book
and the Young Reader Center.
The Center was inspired by Daniel
Boorstin when he was librarian
of the Congress; way back
in 1977 we were created.
And the basic idea was to take
the Library of Congress and reach
out for the first time in
a way to the general public
on the topics of books and reading.
To which we have added of course the
advocacy of literacy and libraries
and rolled it into a package
that also includes the importance
of research and scholarship
in each of those topics.
And we operate primarily though not
only programs here at the Library
of Congress including the
National Book Festival
for which we have a major
responsibility, but also book talks
and symposia and around the
country we are best known
for our state affiliates in every
state including Virgin Islands now
and of course the District
of Columbia.
And our reading promotion
partners, which are nonprofit groups
in which we share an interest
in project development.
We are a private, public
found, not a foundation,
heavens, only if we were.
We are a private public
office, but with the Library
of Congress supporting our salaries.
We're very proud of a couple
of our component units.
One is the Young Readers Center
which was created in 2009
and if you haven't had a chance
it's in the Jefferson Building
and we want you to see it and I'll
be taking some of our, Karen and I.
Karen, the director of
the Young Reader's Center
who I just want Karen
stand up and wave.
There we go.
Let's give Karen a hand [applause].
Karen and I will after lunch
with our informal lunch
with our speakers will take them
over to see that wonderful unit.
Another new part of the Library of
Congress but an old part of the,
a new part of the Center for the
book, an old part of the Library
of Congress is the Poetry and
Literature Center which now also is
in the jurisdiction of
the Center for the Book.
So we are able to pull together
a lot of the interest, literary,
literature, literacy learning
promotion programs for people
of all ages, including
the Young Readers Center.
There are lots of brochures about
the basic activities of the Center
for the Book across the back.
And also I cannot forget
our newest activity,
heavens we also administer the new
Library of Congress Literacy Awards.
Which are initiated and funded
by the local philanthropist
David Rubenstein.
So you can see that we
have a number of programs
that are being pulled
together and we're very pleased
to have you part of
this particular one.
Each of the programs that we
do are taped for our webcast.
It will be posted on the Library of
Congress website at a later time.
So and also will be available on
read.gov which is our website.
So I'd like you to turn off all
things electronic and I would
like to say a little
word about the topic
and then introduce the speakers.
We have deliberately with Karen's
assistance and the assistance
of our speakers taken an
important topic in our area,
which is the reluctant reader.
Why? What can we do about it?
How do we look at it?
How have the graphic novels
of our time changing these?
Or the way we look at them?
What are the opportunities?
All of these will be addressed
in various ways by our speakers.
An article in "The Washington
Post" recently quoted University
of Texas Professor Andrew
Dilley [assumed spelling]
who studies reading who said we're
spending so much time touching,
pushing, linking, scrolling,
and jumping through text
that when we sit down with
a novel, or another kind
of reading your daily
habits of jumping, clicking,
linking are engraved in you
and you miss a good part
of what might be in front of you.
And the study recently released
by Common Sense Media found that
"30 years ago only 8%
of 13-year-olds and 9%
of 17-year-old said they
hardly ever read for pleasure.
And today the situation is worse.
That percentage is it's 22%
of the 13-year-olds and 27%
of the 17-year-olds
that now say that."
What exactly is a reluctant reader?
Well we're going to get a
lot of views on that today.
Because we do know that there are
physiological issues that lead
to reading problems and we'll
hear some of that from our panel.
We'll learn about other factors that
affect children's attention span.
Including of course
their environment
and thus affects their
interest in reading.
And today we are taking a special
look, as I mentioned earlier
at the role that the graphic
novel, or illustrated fiction,
or sometimes comic books have
to play in this discussion.
Graphic novels are one of the few
genre in this publishing field
that are having an
upward growth trend
in the publishing field itself.
And also we do know a number
of educators have pointed
out that the graphic novel genre
can help kids understand some
fundamentals like how events
take place in sequence,
how stories are laid out.
They can build vocabulary and show
that books can be visually
appealing.
I'm reminded in the very beginning
of The Center for The Book one
of the reason that Dr.
Boorstin created it was to show
that the latest technology
which at the time
in 1977, '78 was television.
And our very first
symposium was television,
reading and the classroom.
And bringing these together.
And here we are now examining
a new genre and the sum
of the same perspective
and hopefulness really.
And let's see what we can
do with graphic novels
that we didn't succeed in doing
with television which is another way
of thinking about our problem.
Now let's get started.
Our first speaker is going
to be Dr. Trude Haecker.
She's a clinical associate professor
in pediatrics at the University
of Pennsylvania School of Medicine.
And the Department Safety Officer
for the Ambulatory Care Network
and Medical Director for
the International Medicine
at the Children's Hospital
of Philadelphia.
She's been a practicing
physician for more than 25 years
and she is going to bring us
a valuable new perspective.
In the fall of '96 the hospital
helped launch the Reach Out
and Read project we know about
at the Library of Congress
and I think you probably
know about it too.
It's a national pediatric literacy
program that today comprises more
than 5000 primary care sites
throughout the country.
And Reach out and Read in which
Trude had a fundamental role
in starting this organization,
actually was the first winner
of the Library of Congress David
Rubenstein Literacy Award last year.
So we're very proud
to have them here
and it also indicates
something we have in mind
in developing the program.
As we gradually develop
winners for the Library
of Congress Literacy Awards and
develop the best practices kind
of recognition, we're going
to be bringing more groups
into this network and have
more capability and resources
for sharing ideas, which is what The
Center for the Book is all about.
But right now Trude Haecker is what
we're all about and we look forward
to hearing what she has to say
about the reluctant reader.
Trude?
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
Thank you so much.
It's really an honor
to be here [applause].
You all in the audience are
really experts about reading
and speech language development.
I'm a pediatrician.
I see patients on a regular basis.
And I'm the mother of 2 boys one
who was an avid reader and one
who was a very reluctant reader.
And I can tell you I learned from
firsthand experience and that's sort
of what led us to Reach
Out and Read as a model
of primary care physicians
to be part of.
You say to yourself what does a
physician have to do with reading?
Well we see kids all the time.
Two weeks, 2 months,
4 months, 6 months.
We are in the very honorable
positions with our families.
Families trust us I hope
and we have a partnership.
I think the parents and
ourselves are in partnership
to raise those children and so
to have the opportunity to talk
about the importance of reading
and to do that in the context
of well-child care has been an honor
for me to do over the last 17 years,
we've been having that
program for that long.
You know it spans the age ranges
of the 2-year-old that's coming in.
We talk about the 2-year-old
that's very busy.
Motively driven and is, we talk
about what we call almost drive
by reading where you're sort
of engaging the mother in what
that attention span
is to that child.
To the 6-year-old who
is starting school
and who's struggling with reading.
To the 12-year-old who thinks
is too cool to be reading
and having a little trouble
perhaps in school as well.
We really want to look
at the medical model.
So my approach is to look
at that medical model
to really get a good
history of what's going
on in that child's world.
What's happening in school?
Is it attention?
Is it reading?
Is our behavior a component
as part of that as well?
Is the child hearing well?
Is the child seeing well?
We have to think of all those
aspects of the medical care.
What's going on with the child's
medical list do they have a chronic
disease state?
You know if they're on asthma,
are they getting albuterol is
that making them hyper
not being able to attend.
If they have other
underlying diseases.
What about their past
medical history?
We know that we have an explosion
of premature infants being born.
We know now that that data
suggests that those children
in fact do have attentional problems
and will often have learning
difficulties later in school.
I saw a 24-week premature infant
last week that was 1 pound, 1 ounce.
Came to my office at
4 months of age.
So we really have to be prepared
for managing those
children's learning issues
and to get them prepared to you to
be the recipients of educating them
and managing their care through
the school systems as well.
Certainly family history is crucial
to this we know that about 15%
of kids will have a reading problem
and so family history is a big part
of that for attention disorders
as well as reading disorders
and learning problems in general.
And then a very good idea of what
the social situation going on.
We really have to ask, I work
in inner city Philadelphia.
So who's in the home?
What's happening in the home?
Is English the first language?
Is there a change in
the school setting?
A change in the home itself?
The siblings the parents?
What's going on there
and then I also try
to really spend a fair
amount of time
on what is the parent's
approach to technology to sort
of build off of what John said.
You know where is the TV?
How many TVs do we have
how many hours is it on
and is it in the child's bedroom?
I can tell you I've been asking for
the last 2 years of the patients
that I see and almost to
a person they have a TV
in the child's bedroom.
These are 2-year-olds, 3-year-olds,
5-year-olds, 8-year-olds.
Think about what that
does for attention span.
Think about what does for sleep
habits for what they're seeing at 2
in the morning when
everyone else is asleep.
And the background noise about 30%
of families have TV on
almost consistently.
I take calls still.
I was on call last night
parent called me the TV is
on its 2 in the morning.
What is that about?
So I think really that
issue of TV and technology.
Also when I walk into the exam
room there's a phone there
and it's being used for games
and what does that mean?
So we really have an
opportunity to think differently
about how we approach technology.
Then looking at the
developmental assessment and that's
where Reach out and Read comes in.
And then a good physical
exam is also important.
I make sure there aren't'
dimorphisms or genetic syndromes.
Back you know 25 years ago, 30
years which was not that long.
Fragile X was something
we barely knew about.
Now we know a lot about
fragile X we know a lot
about attention deficit disorder.
We know a lot about these things
and the genetic predispositions
for them.
So making sure that you think about
that when you assess the child.
And making sure what labs we
need to be thinking about.
Nutrition is crucial
to brain development,
so we want to make sure
the child's not anemic.
We want to make sure the
child's not lead poisoned.
Here in Washington,
here in Baltimore,
in Philadelphia we have huge
problems with lead poisoning.
That changes attention.
That change ability to
learn to read and to learn
to function in school settings.
So we want to make sure we're
screening for that as well.
And then working with our
colleagues and referring,
talking to the schools, making sure
we refer to our colleagues as well
to make sure we understand
how we can move forward.
As a pediatrician my issue
is prevention as you can tell
and preventing and so immunizations
is what I sort of do for a living,
but the other piece to
this is really picking
up on Reach Out and Read.
So I wanted to spend 30 seconds
on Reach Out and Read as a model.
We are now, as John said in
5000 offices across the country.
Six million children
served each year.
What I do as a pediatrician is go
in to see the child at 6 months
and take one of these
books, age-appropriate book
and that book becomes my
tool to model for the parent,
becomes my teachable moment.
When I go in and see a 6-month-old
and that mug face sitting
on a teen mom's lap and that mother
has no idea what mother ease is
and how to speak to that baby.
I can model for that.
I can go in the book and that baby's
eyes light up I show this book.
The baby's patting the book, putting
it in his mouth and I can give
that mother permission
for oral motor development
because we know that's so
crucial to later development.
And so the ability to give
a book and in the context
of advice is really a
crucial thing that we can do
in our offices and model.
And I hope that I have what
we call as a bully pulpit
and I don't mean it that way I
know that's a very sensitive term
but I hope I'm a trusted
advisor to the family
and that can make a difference.
For that family to go home.
And we know that research now shows
that children, who are given books,
are read to 4 times more often
and have the ability to begin
to have earlier speech
language development.
So it's very crucial for brain,
so brain development is
crucial to what we do.
The neurons are [inaudible]
the first 3 years of life.
I've got about 3 years to keep
that nutrition going and stimulate
that brain and books have to be part
of that conversation so that there's
that dialogue of reading
that's going along as well
as the interaction what we
call now serving respond.
And so that the mother is being
taught to talk to the baby.
Allowed to really have
that interaction.
To model. I get to do that.
I'm lucky I get to do that every day
when I see babies and really model
that for the parent so they
are given permission to be able
to interact with that
child on a regular basis.
And then the last part of our
program is the environment,
where we give out gently used books.
So every baby from 6 months
to 5 years gets a new book
and then every child who
comes in for a sick visit,
or a sibling that's
coming along over the age
of 6 gets a gently used book.
So that many of the
books that you all have
in your libraries we get donated.
And so at [inaudible] alone we
have given out about 600,000 books
in the last 10 years to children
in West Philadelphia
and South Philadelphia.
That's how important we think
this is for brain growth,
for stress reduction, toxic stress
is the other topic that's out there.
We know that early
intervention, and one on one,
parent modeling makes a huge
difference later for children
to protect them against that stress.
What we're finding now is
that that's actually genetically
predisposed and so mothers
who are developing babies who have
been stressed are now delivering
babies that are not
functioning as well either.
So we have to do everything we
can to reduce that toxic stress
and then look at language
development.
Because that's the best
predictor of a later outcome.
And improved school readiness.
So with that I probably should
stop I've been talking too long.
>> John Cole: I'd like
to thank Trude
for that opening statement
[applause].
Lots and lots to talk about
right there, but now I'm going
to introduce Dr. Claire Agard.
Claire is a National
Certified School Psychologist.
Who holds certifications in the
District of Columbia and Maryland.
She's been a school psychologist
for Prince George's County
Public Schools for 24 years.
Her course of study included
neurologic, neurogenic,
sorry language disorders, memory
and learning, and neurophysiology
in school settings including
identifying educational disabilities
and intervention and
behavior management.
I might say that at the,
on the news release that's
at the back table we have
slightly fuller biographies
of our distinguished
panel, but for now I'd
like to present Claire Agard.
Claire [applause]?
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Thank you.
I was asked to address the
social and emotional problems
that typically accompany
reading difficulties.
Our topic is the reluctant reader
and I've found that typically
when students are reluctant
to read it's
because like anyone they avoid
something that they find difficult.
And most often these children
do go on to being identified
as having a learning disability.
Some of the reasons that you see
children developing social emotional
difficulties are because
they become frustrated
at the continued failure
throughout their academic years.
And there's an estimation
that at least 75% of students
with reading difficulties
develop social,
emotional, or behavior problems.
Sometimes they're constantly
being prompted by teachers
and parents to do better.
Adjectives like lazy are
being used to describe them.
And the child is already
doing the best he or she can.
And, but we fail to realize that.
They typically are
rejected by peers.
They have difficulty some of them
have difficulty reading social cues.
And often difficulty
with oral language.
The oral language difficulties
become much more
of a disadvantage during adolescent
years when that becomes very,
very important in social
interactions.
So those kids are even
more likely to be rejected,
as they become adolescents.
In terms of emotional symptoms,
anxiety is probably the
one most typically seen.
And this can be manifested
in a variety of ways.
Children complaining of tummy
aches, stomach aches trying
to avoid school, headaches.
Sometimes the pattern is such that
you only hear those complaints
Monday through Friday and other
times you hear them throughout you
know throughout the school year.
And then when the stress
is released,
relieved during the
summer, spring vacation,
there's no physical problems.
Right now I'm working
with a high school student
who has been hospitalized probably
for about a total of 45 days
within the last 4 months.
And she's been complaining
of abdominal pain
and nothing can be found,
nothing physiological
is being found, so far.
And psychologists at Children's
Hospital have now referred her
for therapy because they're
thinking its anxiety resulting
from academic difficulty.
As it turns out this student
does have a learning disability
and is receiving special education.
We're not sure that that's
the origin of the problem,
but it could be and there's a
very good chance that it is.
Some of these children
anxiety is expressed
by clowning around in class.
That way they receive
attention from peers
and it's not necessarily negative
because they're entertaining
the class.
At the same time they're
avoiding doing something that's
anxiety provoking.
So the clowning around helps
them to relieve their anxiety.
These, the children with anxiety
often is generalized outside the
school setting and they may have
difficulty entering new situations.
Or anything that involves a
transition may become anxiety
provoking for them.
So the anxiety isn't just
confined to the school setting.
Just its typically
generalize outside and in
such cases these children
may go on to be identified
as having an additional disability
on top of being learning disabled.
Depending on how the anxiety is
affecting academic performance
there's a likelihood that
they could be classified
with an emotional disorder.
If it's significantly impacting
academic achievement and ways
in which we sometimes see the
anxiety impacting academic
achievement is through
school phobias one
of the ways you see them.
Or students cutting classes and
roaming the hallways and we think
that they're just being
difficult and it's not
that they're just being
difficult they're just trying
to avoid an anxiety
provoking situation.
In terms of depression, children
with reading difficulties tend
to report depressed mood
at a significantly higher
rate than other students do.
Unfortunately adults, not
because they don't care,
but just because they don't know,
they often miss depression in kids.
Or adolescents.
And that's because it
typically presents differently
from the way it presents in adults.
Often in children and adolescents,
depression presents as irritability
and they attempt to be, they come
across as being bad tempered.
Some studies have suggested
that there is a difference
between the way girls
express their depression
and the way boys express
their depression.
And it seems to be related to
the way we've been socialized.
Boy typically don't show, I'm
supposed to be, they're supposed
to be men and not show emotion.
So they're more likely to exhibit
the aggressive kinds of behavior
where girls you're more tend to
see the depression being manifested
through withdrawal and
those kinds of things.
The children adolescents in addition
to the irritability
short tempered behavior,
they do exhibit the
symptoms that adults exhibit.
And probably problems with sleep.
Either getting to sleep when they
get to bed, they may lie awake
for hours or early morning
awakening, 3, 4 o'clock
and not being able
to get back to sleep.
Changes in appetite.
Most people think that you lose
appetite when you're depressed.
But there is a group
of individuals who tend
to overeat when they're depressed.
So it can be manifested either way.
Loss of interest in things they
had previously found interesting,
exciting.
Those are some of the ways you
see depression being expressed
in children.
They're studies that show
that amongst children
who are having difficulty reading
there's a higher percentage
of delinquency.
And I read someplace that
among the prison population,
when they're surveyed that more
than 50% report having experience
difficulty reading while in school.
And some years ago it was
reported, I think it was Texas
that was using grade
level reading ability
to project their prison
population 10 years advanced.
Because they found that there's
such a close relationship
between reading ability
and delinquency.
These children have poor
self-image, as you would expect.
They use a lot of negative
statements to describe themselves.
They feel as though they have
no control over their future.
There's no relationship between
their effort and outcome.
And they often tend to see
the environment as a whole
as being negative and
sometimes threatening.
There is even impact in the family
because reading disabilities
typically is genetic.
About 50% of the heritability
is genetic and the rest
of it comes from the environment.
So more often than
not there is a parent
that has had reading difficulty too.
And these parents sometimes
cope in one of 2 ways either
by ignoring the fact that
it's really a disability
and may constantly be on
the child to try harder.
Or in other ways they relive their
frustration through the child
and it causes their
parenting skills to suffer.
Am I out of time?
Karen had asked me to mention how
we go about identifying children
in the school system with
a reading disability.
And it's typically a test battery.
But prior to that we get a referral
and the referral looks at the kinds
of things that are
being seen in class.
The interventions that have been
tried what has been successful,
what has not.
The test battery consist of IQ
test and academic test and test
of what's called information
processing.
Like volunteering processing, visual
processing, those kind of things.
And it's because the definition
of a learning disability
include a disorder
of the psychological processes, such
a memory phonological awareness,
and those kinds of things.
Once a student is identified they
receive special education services.
And now that the movement is a move
toward inclusion this is provided
in the classroom typically.
The special ed teacher
goes into the classroom
with the regular education teacher.
Children with more serious
disabilities may be in what
in our system we call them
the intensive resource classes
and those are classes with a
small teacher student ratio.
And I think I'll stop there.
>> John Cole: All right well
thank you very much Claire.
[ Applause ]
What did I tell you a whole
other perspective to chew on.
Our next speaker is Jarrett
Krosoczka who has been passionate
about story telling through words
and pictures since he was a kid.
He began his professional career
by illustrating educational readers
for a national publisher while
he was still an undergraduate
at the Rhode Island
School of Design.
He's the author and illustrator
of 10 "Lunch Lady" graphic novels,
which are published by Random House,
as well as the "Platypus Police
Squad" middle grade novels.
And numerous other picture books.
And he is a 2-time winner of the
Children's Choice Book Award,
which is sponsored by the Children's
Book Council another partner
of ours.
I'm please to present Jarrett.
Jarrett [applause]?
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
Thank you everyone.
So as an author and
illustrator for children's books
from the very beginning of my career
people would always ask me what my
favorite book was to read as a kid.
And I'd always go back to just
these 3 books which are very near,
and dear to my heart and I
still have my childhood copies
on my bookshelf in my studio
and those books are "The Mouse
and the Motorcycle"
by Beverly Cleary.
And "James and the Giant
Peach" by Roald Dahl.
And "Bunnicula" by James Howe.
And I would always go back
to just these 3 books.
Even after the "Lunch Lady"
graphic novels had gained
in popularity I would only
go back to those 3 books.
Like what did you like to read?
Well when I was a kid that
was really the only thing
that really qualified as reading.
But on further inspection
of my bookshelf
in my art studio you will
find old "Garfield" treasuries
and "Snoopy" treasuries and
"Calvin and Hobbs" treasuries.
And collections of
"Batman" graphic novels.
And I realize that I was reading you
know I read so many comics as a kid
but that wasn't validated
as reading for me
and I could only imagine how much
more confident I would have grown
as a ready if that were the case.
I mean every day my grandfather
would come home from work
in the evening and I would grab the
newspaper and I would go straight
to the comic strip section.
And I would go down to my
favorites and for about a year
and a half you know I as trying to
save money so I would make my own
"Garfield" treasuries by
cutting it out every day
and placing it in a photo album .
And if I couldn't get a ride to
the comic bookstore I would walk.
And it was a mile and
a half from my house.
And I feel like this is
a story for my grandkids.
But I would walk 3 miles just to
learn what happened to Batman,
and Superman, and Spiderman,
and the X-men.
And so when I reflect on
that I thought I was willing
to walk 3 miles to read.
But that wasn't validated as
reading to me when I was a kid.
So I feel so very happy for
the young students today
who have educators
who are championing.
Championing graphic novels and
allowing books like "Lunch Lady"
and "Baby Mouse" to exist in their
school libraries and to be handed
out and to those, especially to
those librarians who still have
to educate some of the
classroom teachers who might say,
or parents who might say only allow
our kids to checkout real books.
I was at a, I was visiting
a school in Houston
and this librarian shared this
story where a parent came in
and said you know don't
let my child checkout the
"Garfield Treasuries" anymore.
Just real books.
And she put on her brave face
and she looked at the mom
and she said you know
when you take your child
to the playground do you say
to your child like you need
to get up on those monkey bars.
And you have to be on those
monkey bars for 20 minutes a day.
And if you can't to the monkey
bars then you don't know how
to play, that's you know.
No you allow your child to
find the playground equipment
that they most feel
comfortable with.
So maybe they're going on the slide
and maybe they're going
on the seesaw.
And eventually they'll
get up on the monkey bars.
Because what I've seen over the
years in educators who have used
"Lunch Lady" and I
should say it is something
that totally took me off guard.
I mean I really, my
only motivation was
to draw a lunch lady fighting
off evil robots with fish sticks.
Like let me just put that out there.
Like that was my goal in life.
But you know life had a different
path for "Lunch Lady" and me and so.
We can't like expect
our kids to come to us
in where we need them to be.
Like we have to meet
them where we are right.
So what kind of tools can we
use to meet them where they are?
Books that are of very high interest
but low readability are just a
great way to hook those kids in.
And whatever it takes.
You know nonfiction book about
dinosaurs or a goofy strange,
little funny weird comic.
And as a parent now, I
have 2 daughters at home.
Zoe is 5 and Lucy is 2.
And my wife Gina and I learned
pretty quickly when we were getting
that baby room ready
for that first kid
that it would actually
be more important for us
to spend our time filling
that room with books
than it was getting the
changing table, right.
The baby comes you run to the store
and get some diapers, you know.
And that's something that we
really try to educate the people
in our lives that you just need
to like read to kinds from day 1,
and day 2, and day 3, and day 4.
And we had a friend of ours who told
us you know her child was 10 months
at the time and she said I read
a book to him for the first time
and you know he didn't
really get it.
So we're going to put
the books away.
And when he can understand
the story, we'll do it.
And I thought this child is going
to spend the rest of
his life catching up.
And it's not about
understanding the story.
You know day 1 we read "Goodnight
Moon" and I got through halfway
through the story and it wasn't
because she found it dull
and derivative, you know she
was upset about her stomach
or something I don't know.
But you know what our children
learn is that reading is something
that we do together and
it's an act of love.
And the parents are showing you
the child that we love you so much
that we're going to spend this
time with you and we're going
to read this story together and
when it was safe to leave books
in the crib, or any
object, 10 months.
We would leave a little
board book and we could see
on the video monitor our
daughter just turning.
The pages and mouthing words
and she was understanding
this is the process.
Now when she was about 3, she would
choose a different book every night
and she would sleep with a
couple of books and one night
as I was turning off the light Zoe
said, she got really sad, she said
but Daddy I can't read the words.
And I thought oh this is a make
or break moment for me as a dad.
Like don't mess this up Krosoczka.
And I sat on the edge of her bed and
I said but you can read the pictures
and that is real reading too
and this confidence
grew back in her face.
And we made sure we had wordless
picture books and she's 5
and a half she'd like to point
out if she was here
she's day 5 and a half.
She's reading the pictures
all the time
and now is starting
to read some words.
So thank you.
>> John Cole: Great.
[ Applause ]
Thank you.
Thank you Jared.
Stephan Pastis is the creator of the
"Pearls Before Swine" comic strip
and also the "Tommy Failure"
series published by Candlewick
of books for young readers.
He took an unusual root to becoming
the number 1 bestselling comics'
creator that he is.
He went to law school.
As a child he spent many hours
drawing and contributed cartoons
for his school newspaper.
But by the time he
graduated from UC Berkeley.
He didn't expect that his
avocation could give him a career.
His "Timmy Failure" series is
published in 40 languages worldwide
and this summer the ALA the American
Library Association selected
"Timmy Failure" for its national
summer reading poster, Stephan.
>> Stephan Pastis: Thank you.
[ Applause ]
Yeah thank you very much.
Like he was just saying I really
came, I think I learned how to read
when I was a little kid because
my aunt had this shelf load
of Charles Shultz' "Peanuts" books
and I thought they were so great
and I wanted to learn how to
read so I could read them.
So from the very get
go my attachment
to reading was through comic strips.
In fact it inspired me so much
that even as a little kid I knew
when I grew up I wanted to
do what Charles Schultz did.
Now I took a little detour
became a lawyer for 10 years.
Those are the 10 lost years
of my life [laughter].
But eventually my dream
came true and I got
to be a syndicated cartoonist.
So "Pearls" launched
in newspapers in 2002
and I've done it for about 12 years.
Now a few years ago I was approached
by a children's book agent
who was a fan of the strip
and he asked me if I wanted
to do an illustrated novel for
middle graders, sort of like "Diary
of a Wimpy Kid" and it sounded
like sort of an extension
of what I do naturally which
is combining drawing with art.
And I thought yeah, I
would take a shot at it.
So I came up with this
Timmy Failure character.
Timmy is a little detective
who can take any mystery
and make it more mysterious.
And he's not a very
smart little boy.
He can't solve anything.
But it's been a lot of fun for me.
So one of the things I get to do in
both roles as a comic strip creator
and as the creator of Timmy
is to reach these kids
like Schultz reached me
when I was a little kid.
And it's interesting the
way I do it is sort of odd.
I don't write sort of to the kids,
I don't write down to the kids.
I write to make myself laugh.
And when I do that it seems
like I reach 11-year-old kids.
[Laughter] So apparently
even though I'm 46, I'm 11.
But it's great.
I enjoy it and I get
to see what they like.
You know when you do a comic
strip you have a huge advantage.
Because if you do a book, say you
put out a book a year and then
after the year is up
you get some feedback.
I get feedback on what
kids like every single day.
And I know after 12 years of doing
it I know what they respond to.
So when I went to write the book I
knew I could fill it with those sort
of things to keep them engaged.
I'm also conscious that when I was
their age it sounds like I had a lot
of the problems that you
all described [laughter].
I was always bored in class
constantly bored in class.
So I used sit in the back
of all of my classrooms
and I would draw the entire class.
Because if you sit in
the back of the class
and you draw the entire
class it looks
like you're just the
best note taker ever.
But that's you know
that's what I would do.
So I'm conscious when
I write to these kids
of how easily I was bored.
How quickly I was distracted.
So I try to make Timmy
lively, quick paced.
Not too dense and to
keep them engaged.
It's a real challenge.
So, but anyways I enjoy
it so thank you very much.
[ Applause ]
>> John Cole: Thanks Stephan we have
so many talented people
here on the panel.
I'd like to open the
question session by asking any
of the panelists if
they have any questions
for any of the other panelists?
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Well
like Stephan I really did feel
like Claire was just
like changing the names
to like really respect our privacy.
Like I feel like I just
learned a lot about who I was
in high school from that.
So how could we as authors
or educators in the room
like how can we get some of
the resources that you shared,
or like how could we help you
guys do what you're doing in terms
of reaching those kids who are
having the emotional problems
because they're not
psyched about reading.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: I think
most of it starts at home
and I think not only
parents but teachers too.
They need to learn
to praise children
for their effort and
not for the grade.
Not just for the product.
One of the other things I tell
parents that I work with is
that you find something
that the child is good at.
It could be an extracurricular
activity.
Another academic subject.
Something.
Something where they're experiencing
success so that all the focus isn't
on you know the weakness.
And I think that's something
that kind of cuts across.
The parents have to do that
but I think teachers have to.
Teachers need to do that too.
And one of the things that I
meant to mention but forgot to,
I work in a school district
where we have a huge percentage
of bilingual students, I don't know
what the supervisor is here maybe
she can say what.
>> About 22%.
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
And let me back up.
I'm the parent of a son who
started attending a bilingual school
from age 2 and a half and then
from age 4 right through to the end
of 8th grade he was in
an all French school.
So I quickly learned that you
know reading is a process.
Because he never learned to read
English until the 4th grade.
And I remember the
first book he read
and he's still keeping it was the
very first "Harry Potter" book.
Somebody gave it to
him as a birthday gift.
And I kept watching him
do it has caused me to say
to my parents reading is a process
to the Spanish speaking parents,
if you can't read English
read to them in Spanish.
It's still reading.
Eventually they make the transition
from one language to the other.
And it's actually true reading
in one language doesn't hamper
reading development in another.
And I think that's
something we need to get
across to both teachers and parents.
Because there are actually
teachers out there
who actually discourage reading
in the language other than English
when in deed it actually helps.
Studies have shown that children
who are bilingual tend to do better
on lots of academic
standardized test.
As well as throughout
the school year.
So that's something I thought
was important to mention.
>> John Cole: Trude to you
want to respond to Jarrett.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Sure first
I want to respond to Claire
because I think the other issue is
the literacy level of the parent.
And understanding what the
literacy level of the parent is
and when we give books out and
we have parents take books,
it's really about telling a story.
You know the [inaudible] we
have 20% of the population
that you know can't
read a bus schedule
and maybe it's even
higher than that now.
So we really have to keep that
in mind as we're seeing kids
in the context of visits.
They really talk about sharing a
book not necessarily reading a book.
They could talk about stories and
bring things in from their culture.
So I agree with you wholeheartedly.
Many parents ask me about
second language issues
and absolutely you want to
keep talking fluently to them
in all the languages that
are in that household.
And it's not a problem and actually
it does improve brain growth.
We love your books.
And the kids when kids
so the kids come in
and get you know again we're
birth to 6 to 5 really books.
So your books are a
wonderful treat when they come
in as gently used books
for our patients.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Oh thank you.
>> And I think you know you're on
the right track that whole issue
of sort of engaging of the child
talking about that discovery.
Really sort of mixing the
you know sort of the graphics
with the language is really
what we want to engage our kids.
I have 2 patients one that you know
that are now 18 years old tells you
how long I've been a pediatrician.
They were 28-week twins.
One was very sick had G-tube
feedings and for those of you
who know that is, severe
feeding disorder.
Which goes along with
speech language issues
so you really have
to keep that in mind.
And the other was just did perfectly
and was you know an avid reader
and actually getting those
kinds of graphic novels,
now that they're 18 seeing some
of the books that you have written
and other have written
really helped her.
She actually was able to
find a source for her life
so she's going to culinary school.
She got into a magna
program for culinary school.
And it was because recipe for
concept through that kind of sort
of mixing of you know sort
of reading abilities is really
what made her life more useful
and more helpful.
So I think you know I would
say just keep on going
and maybe we can think about.
I mean one thing for Reach
Out in Reading that's an issue
is we really try to create a love
of reading and a love of
books so that we avoid
that reluctant reader later.
We can't do that obviously
that goes without saying.
But you know sometimes
I think authors
that could give us a bit more of a
message about struggling with some
of these messages would
be very helpful for kids.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Cool.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: So.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: I have
another question for Trude too.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Sure.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
Thank you for that.
So a big concern of my wife's and
mine is that you know a big part
of also raising the readers not just
have reading to them all the time
but having them see
you read for pleasure.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Absolutely.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: You know.
And we find ourselves okay we
need to take this little device
where we're on like Facebook
and Twitter and reading the news
and like hide it because I feel
like they're catching us
using it all the time instead
of having like a physical book.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Yeah.
Jarrett Krosoczka You know
and are there studies being done is
there something we need to address
that because I mean
we're conscious of that
but I can't imagine everyone is.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
Everyone isn't.
And we probably have more
experts in the room in here.
But the people at [inaudible]
in Philadelphia [inaudible]
and the University of Delaware
are really beginning to do some
of those studies and we
know that that's going
to be a very big concern for us.
That attention span, the
graphics moving the Einstein.
"Baby Einstein" actually was pulled.
You know there was
a lawsuit because of
that because there's nothing there.
You're just watching fish
go across the screen.
What good is that?
I mean nothing.
I mean really And so the whole issue
is the AAP actually has standards
you can go to the AAP website on
guidelines for media use and for
and we recommend no electronic
devices before the age of 2.
I can tell you that's
not always easy.
And less than 1 hour of TV a day.
I mean the average
2-year-old, 8 hours.
It's ridiculous.
I mean it's unbelievable
what we're seeing.
So I agree with you totally there
are studies that are being done.
We just don't have the data.
But intuitively I can tell
you that it's not good
for attention, it's not interactive.
We know that neurons are stimulate.
There's genetics and
there's also the interaction.
So talking to your
daughter, reading to her,
spending time drawing spending
time with her and doing
that dialogic back and forth.
That's what's going to make that
brain really ready, you know.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: And even
just sitting quietly next to them
if they have their book so they
can actually see you reading.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Exactly.
Exactly. And that's you know
for the inner city families
that we serve that's a big issue.
I mean we did a study about 10
years ago and there were less
than 20 books in the
home and we'd had Reach
out for Reading 10 years already.
I had 10 books on my nightstand.
That is emphatical.
You make home visits and
they just don't have books.
That includes the books
we give them.
So there's really just
not that culture and now.
There's also the, you
know we're very careful
because the other issue is
making sure they're ready
for school you see that you
know learning your letters,
learning your numbers,
learning your colors.
Well that's important, but
that's not really the point.
You know it's not about that
[inaudible] I mean it's more
about the dialogue and what and
the richness of the experience
and asking the kids
questions about that you know
and the economics are phenomenal.
I mean and has anybody learned
of the 30 Million Word Project.
If you haven't Googled
that you must.
It's a University of Chicago.
It's amazing.
Teaching inner city families
about how much a difference
stimulating a language early on,
getting kids loving books,
reading makes a difference.
You know the number of words
you're exposed to if you're
in a middleclass family is 2
to 3 times the number of words
that you're exposed to if
you're in an impoverish setting.
So it's really a huge issue.
It really is.
And I feel like those
little Blackberries
and Crackleberries are
making things worse.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: You know
one of the things I've seen some
of our elementary school
teachers do for students
who are not very literate they
have lent the families books
with they used to be books on tape,
but I guess now they
are CDs on tape.
So the child can listen to it
was following along in the book.
And those have been loaned to
students who have a disability.
And just to other students who
were you know learning English.
And those are pretty
helpful in those situations
so that's something
that can be done.
>> John Cole: Any other
questions from the panel?
Let's go the audience anyone,
and please identify yourself
and we'll bring a microphone around
before you lay it on us okay.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Some
water before we start here.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: I know.
>> Kathleen Boodie: My name is
Kathleen Boodie [assumed spelling],
I am a fifth grade teacher with
Fairfax County Elementary School.
I am wondering if Dr.
Agard, how you?
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Agard.
>> Kathleen Boodie: Agard if
you wouldn't mind just going
across the street to the Capitol
and telling them your quote,
praise the kids for
effort not for product.
Because.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: I will.
>> Kathleen Boodie: I feel
like I want to reach these kids
where they are and I have
to but in the same sense
but in the same sense I have
to give them rigorous test
so they're ready for, in
Virginia we have the SOLs.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Yeah.
>> Kathleen Boodie: You know that
state testing and if I meet them
where they are, which is what I
do and we can do small groups,
they're not ready for the
text that comes to them.
So it's a battle and then of
course we're looked as a teacher
and as a school and as a
district how our test scores are.
And that's how we're
identified is by our test scores
and it's not really looking
at how hard these kids
are trying coming from.
I mean and you know being
from PG country but also
in Fairfax County we
have a whole corridor
where it's just poverty
stricken and we get those kids
and they don't know their
letters coming into Kindergarten
and in 5th grade, they're
still reading
on a second grade reading level.
So how can we reach those kids
where they are and still feel
like we are producing in
the way that the county
or the state you know the
data that they want to see?
Does that make sense?
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Yeah.
I don't know if it's
possible to do this
but you know I think it would
be great if all teachers,
particularly elementary school
teachers can set aside probably 10
or 15 minutes at the
end of the school day
where every child is given
a book, chooses a book
at his or her reading level.
Or is helped to choose
an appropriate book
and they can just spend
that time reading.
Years ago we used to have something
in the county called
Drop something and Read.
I don't remember what it was.
But I've seen that around
but I think it would be
something that would be good.
And not pressuring parents.
Where children can choose
things of high interested.
Whether it's a "Sports
Illustrated" magazine
or a comic book or whatever it is.
And there's no pressure.
If they ask for help
they're given it.
You know if they're just using
context clues pictures to read.
That's fine whatever.
That's one thing I think we can do.
>> Stephan Pastis: Did you
say the state test was SOL.
>> Kathleen Boodie: Yeah.
>> Stephan Pastis: That is
a terribly ironic acronym.
Wow.
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
You know one of the,
Trude mentioned risk
factors, medical risk factors.
One of the things that I tend
to look at when I get a referral
for testing I, you know
I try to get as much
of the medical history as I can.
But sometimes I get students
and the parents who ask
about the environmental allergies
and the parents will say yes.
Oh he has that all year long.
And it's never been treated.
And sometimes these children who
are congested a lot they miss
out on a lot of language.
And I think one of the things that
we somehow need to get parents
to understand yes environmental
allergies aren't going
to cause your child to keel over
and die, but you know they need
to be treated because they can
negatively impact both oral
language, reading skills, spelling.
All of that.
And that's something
that's sometime overlooked.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Right.
Right. And I think
hearing I mean the,
you know if you've got allergies
your ears are going to be filled.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Right exactly.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: So you're
going to have auditory process.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Exactly.
>> As well.
So yeah I think that's very
true no question about it.
And a lot of kids with
allergies have midface hypoplasia
so they're ability to do oral motor
functioning is very difficult.
They often have eating
disorders as well.
We often failure to thrive
in kids who have snoring.
I mean that's the other epidemic
we're beginning to see is snoring.
I ask my patients about snoring.
It's amazing how many
kids are snoring.
And what we used to think tonsils
and adenoids was kind of silly
but actually we are
seeing a lot of kids
that really actually do need their
tonsils and adenoids removed.
They breathe much better.
They feel much better.
They're much more alert.
In addition to having ability
to manage their airway
and also eat better.
I mean they, you know the child with
failure to thrive you have to think
about that in your differential.
>> John Cole: So I've been thinking
a little bit about how kids feel
about themselves and some of
the speakers have talked about
and yesterday we were lucky enough
to be in the Young Readers Center
to have Stephan talk about
his books and his career
in a wonderful presentation.
But we never did talk about at least
when I was around the word failure
and how you came up with the
word failure for the Timmy books
and your thinking behind that.
And I?
>> Stephan Pastis: When I come
in, I mean I just do a sort of a,
I have a comic strip mentality
so I'm always just looking
to make myself laugh and Timmy
is such a cute, sweet name
and failure is such
a blunt, harsh word.
So the 2 of them together, Timmy
Failure just made me laugh, but.
>> John Cole: Oh you
11-year-olds [laughter].
>> Stephan Pastis: Yeah but you
know it's funny like when you want
to get a kid's attention
you sort of,
I learned this from the comic strip.
You sort of have to hover on that
line of appropriate inappropriate.
And you really engage
them when you're there.
So you know Timmy has a best
friend who's a little over weight.
His name is Rollo Tookus [laughter].
And yeah you know I mean I
use the word stupid a lot,
I use the word dumb and I know some
of it's not appropriate,
but kids love it.
I mean they really they
don't talk like you do.
I mean they talk like you
know their friends talk.
So I can feel it like yesterday
when we did the talk in the room.
They feel like they're
in on something.
Now as I'm kind of saying
stuff that's maybe not
in the textbook a little bit,
but at the end of the day,
they've read the book and I've snuck
in the book a whole
bunch of very big words.
Like I must have mendacity
in there 20 times.
But I do it I try to
always do it so that
in context the word makes sense.
So Timmy would yell, "Lies,
lies, mendacity" or something.
So without realizing it
I sort of engage them
on the appropriate
inappropriate level.
And then I stick in those kind of
big words and hopefully they learn.
Because that's how I learned.
I learned the word from reading
"Peanuts" I learned the
word philosophy, theology,
psychiatry all of that so yeah.
I think if you approach
kids from that theory,
you know is it appropriate, you
know you bore the heck out of them.
And if the point is
I'm trying to get them
to read the book, I
can't have that voice.
I have to have that
borderline voice.
That's just me.
>> John Cole: Well Jarrett, I'd
like you to address the same thing
and also in your case,
also how you chose the
"Lunch Lady" you know as a title.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Sure
and [inaudible] it's just
like there's no reason why Captain
Underpants and Charles Webb can't
like coexist on a child
reading [inaudible].
Like there's absolutely no
solid argument against that.
So the "Lunch Lady" books
you know I was inspired
by a chance encounter I had
with my childhood lunch lady.
I was an adult back in my old
elementary school with my first book
and there she was getting
lunch ready.
And I said hi.
And she was telling me
about her grandkids.
And I thought you leave
school and have a life.
I never thought about that before
and so I started writing a book
about the secret life
of lunch ladies.
And inadvertently broke
rules of publishing.
Like there's a rule that like the
book has to be about children.
Well she's like in her late 40s
and she's got a big old perm.
And then like boys won't read
books starring a girl protagonist
and I have parents coming up like
what a great boy book this is,
and I'm like you know
there's a 48-year-old woman
on the cover right [laughter].
And because I'm big proponent of
you know getting girls to read books
about boys and getting
boys to read books
about girls for whatever reason.
I was in 7th grade for my September
book report I did it on Anne
of Green Gables and
because I was so,
I was always obsessed with series.
So like yeah I needed
to know what happened
to like Wolverine in the next issue?
But I needed to read Anne of
Avonlea because what was going
to happen next [laughter]?
You know and so whatever educator
said I'm going to just see,
see if he's going to
read this book too.
You know I mean so
you know I don't think
that we should also let
your preconceived notions
of what a kid is going to get
excited about to prevent us
from trying to put a
book in front a reader.
>> John Cole: You know it's
great to have the 2 of you here
because there is a gap in some ways
I see and I think we recognize it
between the writer and
the appeal to the audience
and the kids in a gut kind of way.
And those of us more on the
research or the academic
or the book promotion side
that also go along with some
of the what we think
is the current research
or what really seems
to be the right thing.
And I think having a discussion
to hear you guys say exactly what
you feel about how you title books
and how you think about keeping
your writing interesting enough
to you you know to continue in
this kind of specialize genre.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah will
when I was writing the first few
"Lunch Lady" books I actually went
and reread all of the comics I wrote
in 5th and 6th grade and wrote
with that very direct language.
And I'm fascinated by all of the
statistics too like especially
with the psychology of it all.
I feel like I mean I didn't
see a therapist as a teenager,
but I guess I'm dealing
with that now probably.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: You
know mention was made
about sticking big words
in the book it reminds me
of the Lemony Snicket book
I don't remember, I thought
>> John Cole: I'm sorry
but what book?
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Lemony Snicket.
I don't remember what
they were called.
I found them very discouraging
and I always referred
to them as the miserable kid.
But [laughter].
What was the name?
>> Stephan Pastis: "Series
of Unfortunate Events."
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
Yeah that's what it was
and he would state a word and then
he would go ahead and define it.
And that happened just
about on every page.
So the children were
reading the full story,
they're getting the
vocabulary they're used to
and he always defined them.
And they loved the books, I
thought they were discouraging,
but you can [laughter].
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah,
I don't ever hold back
from vocabulary you know in my
picture books or in any of my books.
I mean.
>> John Cole: Stefan did you
pick a word or 2 ahead of time
that you wanted to make
certain got into that book?
>> Stephan Pastis: No.
I just, I again I just I think
there's a whole series of sort
of insults, like late 19th century
insults like MR Twain used a lot,
but not for any reason other
than I find them funny.
I think they sound funny.
>> John Cole: Right.
>> Stephan Pastis: So yeah, yeah.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: And I don't
you know I think Stefan I heard
like any cartoonist, I think we are
writing for our 11-year-old selves.
>> Stephan Pastis: Absolutely.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: We're
writing to entertain ourselves.
We're lucky enough
that our mentality is
that of a 10-year-old kid
[laughter] and they like our books.
>> John Cole: Thank you.
Let's turn back to the audience.
There's a hand in the very back.
Sir? Yeah?
>> Jarreau Williams: Thank you.
Good morning my name is
Jarreau Williams I'm the Manager
of Theatre Programs at National
Children's Museum at National Harbor
and you all talked about you
know how, whether it was looking
at comic book strips or you know
just drawing helped to inspire you
to write and learn to read.
And for me it was acting
and really Disney movies
that was kind of my
age of growing up.
I you know watched those Disney
movies over and over, and over,
and over again until I learned all
the songs and then I made me want
to read plays and then to know plays
and you know study those things
and I think it's safe to say for
most of the people in this room
that the arts really helped
to make us who we are.
And now you're seeing
in a lot of schools
where the arts are being taken out
or being halfway cutout
of a lot of programs.
And I'm just curious to see what
your take is on the connection
between the arts and reading
and then you know also
specifically theatre as well
because that's the you know program
that I run so I'm just curious
to see what your viewpoint
is on that.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah I mean I
wouldn't be a reader if it weren't
for comic strips and comic books or
for instance I read the novelization
of the 1989 "Batman" Movie
like 6 times you know.
And I just I've always
loved characters
and I would take characters anyway I
could get them and fortunately a lot
of those characters would
go back to the printed word.
You know whether it was
like I loved "The Smurfs"
so then I would read Smurf
books you know and all
of these different medias
again they all can coexist.
But it's all about trying to, how do
you balance that in a child's life.
Like how do you limit their
various screening times.
But for me all of those kind
of visual mediums supported
my excitement to read.
>> Stephan Pastis: Yeah, same thing.
I don't know why we have
a prejudice against a book
if it has drawings you know
like it has words I mean
why does that matter.
I've never drawn that
distinction you know.
Why is it any less good because
half of the page has drawings
and the other half is words?
They're reading, they're engaged,
they learn thought, they learn art.
They learn character development.
Right?
>>
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah and
especially with picture books
because then they can that might you
know I don't know what that word is
but you can look at the
illustrations for context for clues.
You know and that, they
really do support each other.
Especially you know I tell
students and educators.
Like you know a book with
illustrations you need
to read the pictures too because
if you're not reading the pictures
you're missing a part of the story.
>> John Cole: Right.
Clair or anything you want to say?
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
I agree [laughter].
>> John Cole: All right,
all right Trude?
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: You know I
think music as well is another one
that studies suggest that
kids exposed to music as well
as art do better with brain
development seems enhanced.
So I think you're absolutely
on target there.
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
You know I wanted to.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
I think it's very sad
that you know budgets are
getting cut and all that.
>>
>> Dr. Claire Agard: When you
said fill your daughter's room
with books I was thinking
books and music.
You've got to have music.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah,
yeah you need instruments too.
And also and not just in the bedroom
but in as many rooms as you can
and where they can reach them.
You know sometimes it's like
this beautifully baby room
and like the bookshelf
is like up there.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Yeah.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: You know.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: You know
I used to this is horrible
but when my son was younger he loved
book, or music and he had loads
of CDs and those CDs were or
cassette tapes or whatever
and I would take them away and
that would be my punishment.
I wanted him to behave.
Take away his music.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah.
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
[inaudible] so painful though.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Yeah.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
We're not going to.
>> Dr. Claire Agard: Well it worked.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
You don't get in bed
at a certain bedtime then
like oh come through.
>> John Cole: I think Nicky is next.
Wait for the mic, yeah thank you.
>> Nicki Frennie: Nicki
Frennie I'm the Coordinator
of Early Childhood Services for the
District of Columbia Public Library
and you've talked a lot
about reluctant readers
who have learning disabilities.
But that huge percentage of children
who don't read are also
proficient readers.
So could you comment
on about those readers?
Who and I think a lot
of it is about choice.
But anything else you might
comment about it's not just children
who have difficulties
who aren't reading
for pleasure, its proficient
readers.
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
I think it occurs.
It's likely to occur with
children who have come from homes
where it's not being modelled.
Where reading isn't
something that you just do.
It was mentioned earlier.
I think when children see reading
as a part of everyday life,
they're more likely to do
it, and less likely to give
in to peer pressure of reading
is not cool, you know especially
for boys reading is not cool
you need to be into sports.
So I think the reluctant readers
who are proficient readers are more
than likely not seeing
it being modelled at home
and being reinforced
and they're thinking
that you know it's not cool.
You know there are things
that they should be doing
that will help them
fit in with their peers
so I think their home
situation is a big part of it.
>> Stephan Pastis: Yeah
I mean myself going back
to modeling I would image that this
is something it's not a homework
assignment you're reading
for pleasure because it's fun
and it's awesome and you can have
great story, great character.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Yeah just
reading aloud as well with kids
and think of giving them a choice
and you know whoever the parent
is that has a great voice.
Just use that voice.
Get silly with reading.
I think there's a seriousness
to things
that sometimes I think is what
your brings bring that levity
to you know reading and I think
that's the other thing to look
at sort of stuck reluctant
readers you know that message
that reading can be fun and it's a
great thing to do and we're going
to read aloud together and I'm going
to read [inaudible] the
silliest voice possible you know
so that can model for the child.
I think that may be helpful as well.
>> Stephan Pastis: And I'm
sure many libraries do already,
but maybe having workshops
for parents,
right this is how you can
be an engaging reader.
You know because if the parent
isn't into it and excited,
that's going to pass on right.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: My
husband could do any voice
so it was always the
2-year-old daddy reads.
I mean like that [inaudible]
I'm so passionate
about reading I love reading and
the book would come out of my hand
and into the my husband's had
because he could do Dr. Seuss
and he could to the Lorax
and that voice is still part
of our family culture.
My husband still has to repeat that
voice because that was so important
to the boys and we talk
about how we read together.
So sort of creating that family
memories that you'll have
with your kids and you have with
your kids I think is what we want
to view upon at least
for me and my patients.
>> John Cole: We're
going to take one here
and then we'll go to the other side.
But thank you please.
>> Erica: I am Erica
[inaudible] I'm a librarian here
but I have a 10-year-old and I'm
just while I have you guys here
and I don't mean to pit
you against each other,
but my son is a huge field of
Stefan and "Pearls Before Swine"
and "Timmy Failure" and
probably pretty soon the
"Lunch Lady" [laughter].
>> But he gets in trouble.
You know they're talking about art
in schools and that's wonderful
and I'm a huge advocate
for art in general.
But he just gets in trouble for
drawing cartoons in the back
and he's not a struggling reader.
He's a voracious reader who reads.
He finished "Harry Potter"
before me and he's only 10.
So the whole series.
He reads my parenting manuals
and just you know laughs
about them [laughter].
He reads like crazy, he's not
struggling he's very smart.
But he feels a disconnect at school
and just yesterday is a
perfect example poetry slam
at school he wrote a great poem
it was like words in my head,
I'm dizzy whatever, but it
was deemed inappropriate
because it was too cynical.
Just like you talking about Lemony
Snicket it was too negative.
Alex write something
positive do something.
Let's write something nice about
your vacation and wherever you know.
And he doesn't want to write that,
he wants to write something negative
and this is why he loves
"Pearls Before Swine"
[laughter] because he loves that.
He loves it and he sees the
absurdities of life and irony
and Timmy Failure and
you know the things
that you know just don't go right.
But it's not encouraged
in school because it's
so down and it's so cynical.
And he's very sarcastic and he is
like, he's 11 but sometimes he's
like an adult, or a teenager
or I don't know what.
But how do we encourage, because
I, I love his teacher this year
but she says you know Alex if
you could just you know put this
into something constructive.
But he writes at home
and the stuff he writes
at home I say please do
not bring that to school.
Don't bring that to
school [laughter].
Whatever you do.
I scold him I'm like Alex I
don't want to see that at school,
I don't want your teachers to,
you know because it's so negative.
So how do we combine these things
so that he sees school as a place
where he can write his
comics and be encouraged
and think hey you might be a
graphic novelist someday Alex.
No, he's told like you
need to focus on your work.
So how do we put these things
together so that you know?
>> Stephan Pastis: Well
I would tell his teacher
that you know my son
is going to grow
up to be a very famous author
illustrator and he is going
to design a despicable terrible,
terrible character based
on you [laughter] for not.
Because that's what we do.
I mean that's really how we, it
takes a couple of decades to get
that revenge, but that
is what happens.
Should we call her now and
why are you being such jerk.
I hope she doesn't
watch this, hi Mrs.,
that's why you didn't give your name
>> [inaudible] faculty they don't
encourage that where [inaudible].
>> Stephan Pastis: I was
very lucky that I grew
up with very supportive educators.
When I was in the 9th grade, and
I was always fairly well behaved,
keyword fairly, in 9th grade I would
make friends at the new high school
by drawing funny pictures
of my teachers.
Like they were never obscene but
they were just funny little drawings
of them and in 9th grade English
class my friend laughed a little too
loud and Mr. Greenwood spun on a
dime and saw it was me and kicked me
out of the classroom and I'm
sweating out in the hallway
and he came out and he
said let me see the note.
And I had to give him the
drawing and he looked at it
and he said you're very
talented [laughter].
He said just stop drawing
in my classroom.
And he connected me to the person
who ran the school newspaper then
I was hired to be the cartoonist
for the high school newspaper.
So he could have made a
very different decision
that would have very
negatively impacted my life.
And I spoke of this on
a TED Talk that I gave
and it's been viewed
a bunch of times.
So why don't you maybe share
that link passive aggressively
to your teacher.
>> John Cole: Okay we need to, we're
going to go back here we're going
to need some of the, I
saw a couple of hands way
in the back there we go thank you.
>> Katherine Marsh: Hi my
name is Katherine Marsh
and I'm a children's book author.
I'm also the parent
of a Kindergartener
in the DC Public Schools and I am
interested in talking with you guys
because my son is basically
a reluctant reader,
he's you know the lowest reading
group in his Kindergarten class.
And in my house contrary to what you
were saying you can't go very far
without tripping over a book,
or hitting your head on a book
or turning around and seeing a book
and you know that's all we do is
we read and we talk about read
and I'm always testing
thoughts on him etcetera.
But one of the things that I've
noticed interestingly is a lot
of my friends who have
friends at children
at private schools their children
are not really being pushed
to read yet.
In fact there's really no,
it's very play based, it's not,
and kindergarten has become
much, much, much more academic.
And it was interesting when
my son was getting ready
to start kindergarten
and had some anxiety
about it we actually found an
old Mr. Rogers which we watched
about what it was like
to go to kindergarten.
And he watched it and he felt
better and he thought he was going
to learn you know letters and stuff
like that and then he got there
and it turned out that's not
what kindergarten was like at all
because now it's very academic.
And it's all about learning
to read and it's all
about taking tests
and things like that.
And I think this relates
back a little bit
to what this woman was
saying here about testing.
But my question for you is you
know are we being developmentally
appropriate with children in
how we're teaching them to read.
Especially children of that age.
Because again my son has
been, they've given him tests;
he does not have a
learning disability.
He comes from a family where his
father is you know a reporter,
his mother is a children's
book author.
He has been exposed to
books you know since day 1.
And yet he just like a
lot of boys that I see
in his class are just not
ready to sit down and do some
of the academic skills
that reading involves.
So my question for you is you know
getting back I guess a little bit
to the testing question but you
know can we talk a little bit
about how we're teaching
children to read and how
to be developmentally appropriate
about that especially with boys.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Is he too in
the SOL testing program [laughter]?
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
You're looking at me.
I don't think is should be the
one to answer that question
because I don't think what happens
in early grades is
developmentally appropriate.
I think a lot of what kids are
being asked to do in kindergarten
and first grade they're
not ready for.
So I'm not the one to ask.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Yeah I mean
I would tend to agree as well.
I think it's very sad and I
think that's you know teaching
to the test is what we're
all struggling with you know
and when you have a child like yours
who's going to be a late bloomer,
I mean through temperament.
Each child has a different
temperament you have
to keep that in mind.
You know they're slow to warm
up, kids are take their time
and it is very disappointing I think
and we're all struggling with this
because we are shifting
in this culture
and you know unfortunately some
of that then leads some parents
to just get too focused on
the colors and the numbers.
And that's really not
what it's about either.
And I think it's yeah I don't
know how to change this yet I have
to be honest with you but
I think a conversation has
to keep going on this.
I mean my own son was the way.
He was exactly the same grew
up in a house full of books.
He was the lowest reading group
until he was in third grade
and you know now he's
doing, he loves books.
>> John Cole: So he started.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
He stared in the lowest,
he started in the lowest
reading group
>> John Cole: Lowest grade.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
Until third grade.
>> John Cole: Okay
until the third grade.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
He was having the same,
he was just not ready to sit still.
He was very reluctant.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: I said the
culture of numbers it's so sad.
I mean Stefan and I visit lots
of schools and there's no way
to assign a number to what like that
student gets out of that afterwards.
When I was in the third grade
an author visited our school
and offhandedly paid me a
compliment on my drawing and then
that had a profound effect on me.
>> Stephan Pastis: Yeah no I
feel the same it's so cool.
That's the best thing about what we
get to do when you go to a school
and there's at least 1 kid in every
class who, he's usually the one
who comes up to you at the
very end of the signing,
he waits for everyone to be done
and then he has these questions
that are asked very
quietly but very earnestly.
And so I talk to him as
I would another adult.
And I say hey you know how much
do you draw a day, what do you do.
And I know by the end of
it I've reached that kid.
And that's such a great
thing because I don't know
if I had that when I was a kid.
I think that prejudice you talked
about you know about drawing and all
that you know something's
wrong with it or something,
but I don't know you
know it's funny.
I was going to say when
you asked that question.
I wonder sometimes when I
look back on high school
and we wonder why people
don't read as adults.
I mean I had great English teachers,
9th, 10th, 11th, 12th grade.
I mean they take all
the fun out of reading.
I mean you get "The Scarlet Letter"
that's bad enough but then you have
to analyze all the
different layers of symbolism,
the color symbolism
and the character.
By the time it's over that's a
geometry assignment I mean its
terrible [laughter].
So I remember all that was
going on when I was about 16.
Somebody handed me, it was Kurt
Vonnegut's "Breakfast of Champions",
and it had drawings in
it, little sketches.
And he didn't take
himself seriously.
And it was great and I
said wow books can do this.
They don't have to be all heavy
and serious and they can be fun.
So yeah I wonder that sometimes.
Maybe that's not fair to my English
teachers, but nay you associate it
with this heaviness and un fun
and it shouldn't be that way.
Yeah, I don't know that's just me.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: No
it's all of us actually.
>> John Cole: We'll go out here
to the audience, this lady has.
>> Edie Ching: My name
is Edie Ching I teach
at the University of Maryland.
You're talking about books in
the home and books everywhere
and it's made me think what about
the homeless shelters do you know
of any programs that are trying
to put books in these shelters.
Kids are spending so
much of their time.
>> Dr. Claire Haecker: Yeah.
>> John Cole: We have one over here.
>> Dr. Claire Haecker: I
think every city is trying
to do that so please go ahead.
>> John Cole: Oh wait
for the microphone.
>> Eileen Hanning: Hi
there I am Eileen Hanning
and I'm the education specialist
with The Reading Connection.
Jarrett is an old dear
friend who has supported us.
We, for 25 years have been
reading aloud with children
in homeless shelters
in DC and Virginia,
we're going to Maryland
next year, or the fall.
We provide grownups
who sit, and read,
and talk with the kids about books.
It's all about the
fun and the pleasure.
There's none of the phonics.
There's no testing.
There are no quizzes.
It's about coming in
having an experience
with the books and the other kids.
Hearing stories read aloud
all that language input.
We don't make the kids
read we're reading to them.
We have activities related to the
theme that they're reading about.
The kids get to choose books to
take home with them or take back
to their room, whatever we're.
Homeless shelters, domestic
violence safe houses,
transitional housing,
affordable housing.
And it's all about helping
families create home environments
that support reading and creating
that love of the experience
so that then they're willing
to fight the good fight
to break the code and
learn to read themselves.
>> What [inaudible].
>> Eileen Hanning: The
Reading Connection.
We have a fabulous
website [laughter].
>> Edie Ching: Go ahead
and give us your website.
>> Eileen Hanning:
www.thereadingconnection.org
all one word.
And we also do parent workshops,
and [inaudible] where we work
with parents and help them
build their confidence and learn
about sharing books with
their kids and providing them
with books to read with their kids.
We work with professionals,
we train teachers,
social workers, our
partner agencies.
And then we also have a book
program where we mail books
into the homes of families
at no cost.
So I mean it's there
Edie its happening.
>> John Cole: I'll take a
question in the very back
of the room on that side.
We have about 5 more minutes.
So let's keep the question
short and the answer short
and let's see how many
we can squeeze in.
>> Barbara Pitkin: My name
is Barbara Pitkin and I work
for Prince George's County Public
Schools as a media specialist
and I want to know how do
we reach out to our parents
and get them to become readers.
And not always resort to technology.
Because a lot of the schools are
moving toward getting the iPads
or the Chromebook and the kids
are reading by your technology
but not holding and getting
that textile feel of the book.
So when you have parents who come
in who are reluctant readers their
first thing is oh I'll give them the
iPad they can read
the story on the iPad.
So how do I reach my parents and
tell them you still need to have
that piece of paper in your
hand that you can feel,
and bunny ear the paper
turn back come back to it.
Because you can't do
that on a computer.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: I
would say use the computer
to get that message to them.
I mean if you don't already have
a Facebook page for your library
or a Twitter create one and
then put content out there
and encourage them to, because your
parents are all on Facebook you know
and then that way you'll
get the information
and they'll say oh maybe
I'm oh am I supposed to be
on something else than this.
>> John Cole: Thank you there's
a question in the back row
on this side please, there yes.
>> Beth Decker: Hi thanks
for being here today.
My name is Beth Decker and I am
an elementary school librarian
in Arlington County
and I wanted to go back
to what the DC public librarian was
mentioning is the reluctant reader
who is also a proficient reader.
I have 2 daughters
one's 13 and one's 9.
They were both raised in the
same home by a librarian mother.
The 13 year old reads, reads, reads,
the 9-year-old although she's a
good reader, she scores very high
on her reading SOL test of whatever.
She can read.
She can comprehend.
She can talk to me when
I make her about books.
But she doesn't find
pleasure in reading.
Is that something we
should be worried about?
She finds pleasure in other things
and not reading even
though she can read.
Is that a reluctant reader that
we should be concerned about?
>> Dr. Claire Agard:
I wouldn't think
so I think I'd be more concerned
if she was a reluctant reader
who couldn't read because
we all have preferences.
I probably I mean someone else
may have a different opinion,
but I wouldn't worry about that.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
I wouldn't either.
I think that's exactly.
I mean that's my younger son and
he's doing, you know he loves
to read now, he's actually the more
voracious reader now of all of us
so you know I think it's
just a developmental phase
that kids go through.
It may be some of the things.
They may not have found the
right topic, the right author.
You know I think those are
the things that develop
over time figuring out what
your taste are in reading.
Whether you like fiction,
nonfiction.
I mean there's a lot of things
that go on to that decision to sort
of pick up that book and you
know I think you're doing all the
right things.
You're modeling you
have the books available
and over time it will come.
I mean I don't worry about that
I would agree with you totally.
If there's a deficit there then
that's a very different story then
we need to think about
you know can she see okay.
I mean you know I'm being silly here
but that's what I would say sort
of I wouldn't be worried.
>> John Cole: Okay we're
going to do 3 more questions
and one is right here in
the front, yes right there.
>> Ellie Cantor: Hi I'm Ellie
Cantor I'm part of Turning the Page
and we actually engage families to
support their children's education
and development in DC
[inaudible] schools.
My question was really about
I feel like we've been hitting
on some tension between sort of
a resistance to accept comics
or graphic novels and one
of the questions that come
up with the families that we work
with, if their children are reading
on the computer or you know
reading books in that format.
I know that kind of takes
away the tactile experience
of holding a book.
But do you sort of advise
against that type of reading?
Because I don't I guess is there
a hierarchy now between sort
of the digital reading
experience versus the paper.
>> John Cole: Anyone
want to tackle that?
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
I can jump in on this.
I received a Tweet
one night of a parent
and they said oh my son
is a reluctant reader,
but I give him a "Lunch Lady" book
and here's a picture of him reading
and I open the picture and it was
like this beautiful
serene you know fireplace
and the child was holding a
rectangle that was growing
like [inaudible] and I went to be
thinking like oh well it's great
that he's reading but you
know it is on the screen
and I woke the next day
and there was another Tweet
that said he liked it so much he
instantly downloaded the second book
and read that too and I instantly
thought oh I was judging his reading
life as adults were judging my
reading life when I was a kid too
so I guess at the end of
the day you know reading,
is reading, is reading, is reading.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker:
Yeah I think that's kind
of true I would say that too.
I think that younger infants though
and the younger children really need
that tactile experience
because we know
that oral motor is a very
important step in their development.
So I would say kids number 3
or 4 I'm not so crazy about it.
But the older kids I think
if they're reading
that's exactly right.
I mean you're opening
up another world.
You're supervising it.
Again it's not the mindless video.
I mean they're reading.
>> Stephan Pastis: Oh can
I say one huge advantage
of that electronic
way that I have found.
You know they have that
function now on the Kindle
when you don't understand
a word, you touch it
and the definition appears.
I mean my whole life I've read books
seeing words I don't understand
and thinking like I know you all do,
I'll go to the dictionary
and look that up.
You never go to the
dictionary and look it up.
But when you can just touch it
and the definition is there.
I've learned more words in the last
couple years of my life than ever.
That's a great thing.
>> John Cole: That's
great, that is incredible.
That's right.
I'm going to take one
here in front I think.
All right let's have
her okay thank you.
>> Hi. My name is [inaudible]
and I might be the only
artist in this room.
But I just want to say my daughter.
And I see a pattern here, the second
child is probably less interested
in books as the first child
and my daughter is like that.
But I just want to
say how she loves.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka:
That would be it.
>> The fact that graphic novels
are in a series and she reads
"Baby Mouse" and she says
I'm not sure I like it
but I've finished four [laughter].
But at the library at school she can
tell her librarian oh yeah I need
the fifth book and so she feels like
she is able to read more like that.
The second thing is I do a lot of
literacy work with children in art.
And when they make pictures,
I make them put all those
details in their writing.
So I just recently did
one and the girl had,
her picture of her room
everything was orange.
And I said is orange the
only color pencil you had.
And she said no it's
my favorite color.
My bookshelf is orange, my cat is
orange, me bedclothes are orange.
And so I told her put
all that in your writing.
And she did.
So I think art shouldn't be like a
different block of time from English
or reading and I think
there should be ways
in which they can be connected.
So I don't know what your
thoughts are about that.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: And not
just connecting but also just
for the child's spirit too.
I mean art can help a child get
through those difficult
challenging times
and expressing themselves
in such a profound way.
>> John Cole: Like I
said 2 more questions.
One here and the one over
here and that will be it.
>> Anita Marina: Hi.
I'm Anita Marina from I run the
Read Across America Program for NEA.
Two things.
One I just did an article that
will be in the summer issue
of "NEA Today" on turning
teens on to reading.
Which some tips and one of
which included graphic novels.
Because they're just awesome.
And they're different, it's just
different entry points as one
of my graphic novel
illustrators said.
But the other thing that I wanted to
also talk about for those of you is
to say, is to see whether or not,
I'm involved with We Need
Diverse Books effort.
And so that's really wonderful.
And so I wonder if you're
seeing books with different
by diverse authors with
different characters
so that kids see themselves.
I had a number of authors
at a panel talk
about finding themselves finally
in a book and that turned them on.
It turned them into
writers and illustrators.
I know for all of you for
how you feel about that.
Because there's this
wonderful ground swell
and our students are
more and more diverse
and there's this real
need to have that.
>> John Cole: Any comment
from the panel?
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: No, I
agree with that wholeheartedly.
>> Stephan Pastis: I think we agree.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah entirely.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Certainly
for Reach Out and Read we look
at when we order books,
you know we have
to order thousands and
thousands of books.
We make sure we have a population
that matches that we have.
And we have the doctors look
at the books and the patients
and say you know is this something
you'd be interested in looking at
and having our kids
be part of you know
so that the content is
appropriate as well.
It's very important
to be respectful.
We also have books in like 12
different languages and bilingual.
And so you know that's
all very important
to make sure you're meeting
the patient where they're at.
>> Stephan Pastis: And all of
our children need to be able
to see themselves as
the hero in the story.
>> Dr. Trude Haecker: Yes, yes.
>> John Cole: Okay final question.
>> Sally Fassmen: My name, excuse
me my name is Sally [inaudible] I am
newly [inaudible] volunteer
at the Young Readers' Center.
But I am a retired teacher I taught
preschool special ed for many years
and one of the things we did with
the 4 year olds is have them act
out stories that they're reading.
So they'd act out "The Three Little
Pigs" and "The Three Billy Goats",
and "Cats for Sale"
and the kids loved it.
And you know they, at that
age most of them can't read,
but they were very involved in
the books and they loved the books
and say can we act it can we do it.
And I want to be this person
and I want to be that person
and it got them involved.
And to tag onto that
there was article
in "The New York Times" I believe
it was on Sunday about the lack
of teaching cursive in school.
And there is research to show that
it really helped in writing and,
excuse me in reading,
and in creativity.
And I have a question
for Stefan and Jarrett.
If you had iPads instead of paper
do you think you would have been
as interested in cartooning
as you are would
that had made a difference?
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: Yeah
we would have been able
to read way more cartoons
that we had access too.
And we'd probably be making
cartoons on our iPads.
>> Stephan Pastis:
That's true, yeah, yeah.
>> Jarrett Krosoczka: No I mean I
think in iPad there are programs
that you are just a consumer of and
there are ones that you can create
on and sometimes you can look
at it as just the tool to create
and a tool to read versus something
that you know it takes a lot
of you know self-restraint to
not go like I'm going to go play
with some Angry Birds or something.
What do you think?
What do you think life would be
like for you if you had that?
>> Stephan Pastis: Yeah that's true
I have noticed that with the iPad
like if I read on it I am tempted
to turn to a game now and then
so it is a little bit,
it is a little,
you know there are good
things and bad things about it
so I don't know you know
that's a good point.
I don't know.
>> John Cole: Okay
Stephan had the last word.
I want to thank and actually its
appropriate Sally asked the last
question for the Young Readers
Center because I also want
to acknowledge the help of the
Young Readers Center and Karen
in organizing this, but in
particular I would like you
to join me in a final round of
applause for Trude, Claire, Jarrett,
and Stephan what a wonderful job.
>> This has been a presentation
of the Library of Congress.
Visit us at loc.gov