>> Elizabeth Peterson: Hello, I'm Betsy Peterson. I'm the Director of the American Folklife Center here at the Library of Congress. And on behalf of all the staff, I want to welcome you today to this latest presentation in our ongoing Benjamin Botkin Lecture Series. Just a word for those who don't know much about the series. The Botkin series is an opportunity for the American Folklife Center to highlight and showcase the very best scholarship and work by leading scholars in the disciplines of folklore at the musicology oral history and other cultural heritage fields. It also allows us to enhance our collections. This is an acquisition for us, if you want to look at it that way. The library captures each of the presentations on video, and we add the field, we add the files to our permanent collections. In addition, the lectures will make their way onto the website and will be posted as webcasts on the library's website in a few months where they'll be available to people around the world and for generations to come. So, with that said, this little caveat, if you do have a cell phone on or any other electronic device, if you would please turn it off now, we would really appreciate it. So, today's event is actually kind of a special edition of the Botkin Lecture. It is a theatrical reading of the play "Back Pearl Sings," which will be followed by a discussion with our actors, Roz White and Susan Galbraith, facilitated by NJ Mitchell. And all of our guests are affiliated with the Alliance of New Music Theatre, who are staging a full production of this play this spring. The play was written in 2006 by Frank Higgins, and the play is inspired from some of our collections and by the relationship between John Lomax and Huddie Ledbetter, most commonly known as Leadbelly. Set in Depression era Texas, "Black Pearl Sings" imagines a meeting between a white musicologist from the Library of Congress and a jailed African American woman with a strong footing in musical traditions. The evocative story traces a journey of race and reconciliation, religion and tenacity, and healing and understanding while exploring the preservation of cultural heritage. So, a discussion will follow this reading, and it will focus on the ways in which the library's extensive primary source collections inform the creative artistic process, how artists work with this material, and we'll welcome questions from the audience. But right now, before we quick it off, I'm going to turn things over to NJ. And thank you, and welcome. [ Applause ] >> NJ Mitchell: I don't have much to say because Betsy did such a wonderful job. Didn't she do a wonderful job? Shall we give her a hand? [ Applause ] Again, my name is NJ Mitchell, and on behalf of Alliance for New Music Theatre, we are so pleased with the Library of Congress hosting this event, and we want to particularly thank the Folklife Center. We want to particularly thank Daniel Murray Foundation. We really, really appreciate all of the support that we got from the Civil Rights Exhibit Department with Carroll Johnson Welsh. And if I'm forgetting anybody, I don't mean to. Oh, Guha, who is the head of the Folklife Center, and John, John Fenn who did the work of putting this together. And we're really grateful, John. Thank you so much. Let's give him a hand. [ Applause ] And I want to bring your attention to our brochure and make sure that you see on the back that we have other performances that are coming up that we would love to see your faces again in the audience. And I look forward to leading the discussion that follows and getting a lot of answers from you guys. So, pay attention. Thank you so much. >> Susan Galbraith: Act 1, Scene 1. In the dark, Pearl begins to sing off stage. >> Roz White: Down on me, Lord, down on me. >> Susan Galbraith: Lights up. At a warden's office at a prison farm during a fierce summer day in 1933, Susannah is packing up her autoharp and preparing to leave, and she becomes interested in the singing. >> Roz White: Seems like everybody in this whole wide world is down on me. >> Susan Galbraith: Hey, I want a whoever that is singing brought in here. >> Roz White: Seem like >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl enters in black and white prison stripes. She's there for killing a man. Her ankles are shackled together, and she carries a ball and chain. Well, none of the other women wore jewelry. Sit here. >> Roz White: I can stand. >> Susan Galbraith: The warden won't know. I told him, "stay out." Have the other women told you who I am? >> Roz White: No, ma'am, but if you be from the parole board, don't let this thing fool you. I'll be a good person. >> Susan Galbraith: I don't give paroles. It's okay to look me in the eye. What's your name? >> Roz White: Alberta Johnson. Friends call me Pearl. >> Susan Galbraith: Well, Pearl, can I call you Pearl? >> Roz White: You just did. >> Susan Galbraith: Why you're in prison is none of my business. But you sing better than the other women. People with good voices usually know a lot of songs. >> Roz White: Ma'am, if you can't get me a parole, what can you give? Because I don't need another white woman in a girdle telling me about God. >> Susan Galbraith: It's not who I am. Although, in a way, I do save souls. >> Roz White: Can you save my daughter? She'd be in Houston. That's where I was trying to get. Maybe you can go save her. >> Susan Galbraith: No. My name is Susannah Mullally. I work for the Library of Congress. I go around the country to find songs from the people. I've found that prisons are a pretty good place to look for old songs. If I find a song we don't already have, I use a machine to record the person. >> Roz White: Where would be this machine? >> Susan Galbraith: Car. >> Roz White: You drive a car? You'd be the first woman I ever know drive her own car. Why you do all this? >> Susan Galbraith: When a person dies, a library is lost. History isn't made just by kings and presidents. People who pick cotton and cook meals got a lot to do with it too. And there are things they believe in so much, they sing them. >> Roz White: Like what? >> Susan Galbraith: I found a song once from an old shaker woman on her death bed. [ Singing ] 'Tis a gift to be simple. You're lucky I found that song. Shakers don't believe in having sex. You know what that makes shakers? Scarce. I'm trying to keep the songs of your people from dying out like the shakers. My biggest dream is to find a song that goes back before slavery time. It came here from Africa. >> Roz White: You a white woman. And this be your dream? >> Susan Galbraith: If I can find a song that came here on the slave ships, you know what that would do? We could prove to the whole world that a song can be stronger than even slavery chains. >> Roz White: Has you ever been in chains? >> Susan Galbraith: Well, can I be blunt? >> Roz White: Blunt saves time. >> Susan Galbraith: Your warden recommended several women to me, but not you. Until I know someone's got something I can use, I can't waste time lugging in that machine. None of the others had a song I hadn't already had. You'll have to show me something more than they did. You're old enough. Were either of your parents slaves? >> Roz White: Yes. >> Susan Galbraith: So, if they taught you a song from their childhood, there's a song from slavery time. What's the oldest song you know, Pearl Johnson? >> Roz White: What you get out of it? >> Susa Galbraith: I just told you. >> Roz White: You get the joy of saving our songs, but you can't eat joy. What you get out of it? >> Susan Galbraith: If I'm lucky, I get my grant renewed. That means I don't have to work as a clerk or get married. >> Roz White: So, if I give you something I got, you get money, but I don't? >> Susan Galbraith: I'll give you a cigarette for a song. >> Roz White: You don't get my soul for no cigarette. Now, if I had some money, I could give it to somebody to go look for my daughter. >> Susan Galbraith: I'm not paying until you prove you are special enough to record. And you haven't proved to me that you know anything yet. >> Roz White: Same for you, ma'am. >> Susan Galbraith: I'm not an expert on your people yet, but I want to be. >> Roz White: Can I be blunt, ma'am? >> Susan Galbraith: Blunt saves time. >> Roz White: You ain't no young woman. By now, you ought to be an expert at something. So, how come you not? >> Susan Galbraith: We're wasting time, Pearl. >> Roz White: I don't want to sing to no private. I want to sing to a general who can do something for me. And since you want something I got, the least you can do is call me Ms. Johnson. >> Susan Galbraith: Wait, wait. What is it you want to know, Ms. Johnson? Ask whatever you want. >> Roz White: This job, they pay you money to listen to people sing. Must be a lot of folk wanting this job, but you got it. So, how come you ain't no expert? >> Susan Galbraith: No, I am an expert on songs from the Seven Mountains. >> Roz White: Prove to me you be an expert. >> Susan Galbraith: You may know the melody. People in American put new words to it, so it goes like, oh, don't you remember, sweet Betsy from Pike. >> Roz White: That song is sung by peckerwoods. >> Susan Galbraith: Yes, but I have to call them rural non traditionally educated Caucasians. Back in the, back in the Blue Ridge Mountains of Virginia, I found an old woman who had learned the song with different words when she was six. See if you can see where she learned these words. Oh, when I was single, I had a plaid shawl, and all of the girlies were jealous enough. Still, I love him. I forgive him. And I'll go with him wherever he goes. >> Roz White: Why are you excited about that song? >> Susan Galbraith: Well, she learned it on the boat coming from Ireland about the time people were fleeing Ireland because of the potato famine. And she also knew a different melody to it, the original Irish melody with the original words. He, he came up to the farmhouse. No, up to the farmhouse, and he whistled me out. The tail of his shirt from his trousers hung out. Still, I love him. I'll forgive him. And I'll go with him wherever he goes. He gave me a handkerchief, red, white, and blue, and said, I am leaving. Why don't you come too? Red, white and blue. He's going to America. Still, I love him. I'll forgive him. And I'll go with him wherever he goes. Oh, when I was single, I had a plaid shawl. And now that I'm married, I've nothing at all. Still, I love him. I'll forgive him. And I'll go with him wherever he goes. You see? Well, she goes with him to America. But she's had to sell or barter her shawl for food. The song is a warning that times will be hard in America, and that people have to stick together. >> Roz White: You get all that from the song? >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, it's the biggest discovery I've ever made. You can turn that song into a college teaching job at an Ivy League school. >> Roz White: So why you didn't? >> Susan Galbraith: You know any old songs or not? >> Roz White: I know some play songs I learned when I was a child. My mama learned them when she was a girl too. >> Susan Galbraith: That gets us back to slavery time. >> Roz White: Yeah, how about some money? >> Susan Galbraith: Song first. >> Roz White: We call this Little Sally Walker. >> Susan Galbraith: I got that. >> Roz White: There's different Sally Walkers. How yours go? >> Susan Galbraith: Little Sal, Little Sally Walker. >> Roz White: Bad. Bad. You got to let your body flow. >> Susan Galbraith: Okay, so let me see you flow. >> Roz White: A little hard to flow with a ball and chain. >> Susan Galbraith: Try. >> Roz White: First thing, there's different ways for different, for how old you is. Your way be fine if you five years old. But when you sweet on a boy, your body talks. Little Sally Walker, sitting on a saucer. Ride, Sally ride. Wipe your weeping eyes. Put your hands on your hips and let your back bone slip. Now, shake it to the east. Now, shake it to the west. Now, shake it to the one that you love the best. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: That shaking is nice. Can I see that all again? >> Roz White: Can I see 50 cents? Let loose your hips. Little Sally Walker, sitting on a looser. Ride, Sally ride. Wipe your weeping eyes. Put your hands let it flow. Hips, and let your back bone slip. Back. Now, shake it to the east. Now, shake it to the west. Now, shake it to the one that you love the best. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: I think I've got it. I think I've got it. >> Roz White: No, I can tell you ain't never danced nasty. >> Susan Galbraith: Sing it again. >> Roz White: Little Sally Walker, sitting on a saucer. Ride, Sally ride. Wipe your weeping eyes. Put your hands on your hips and let your back bone slip. Now, shake it to the east. Now, shake it to the west. Now, shake it to the one that you love the best. Okay. >> Susan Galbraith: Okay. >> Roz White: Little Sally Walker, sitting on a saucer. Ride, Sally ride. Wipe your weeping eyes. Put your hands on your hips and let your back bone slip. Now, shake it to the east. Now, shake it to the west. Now, shake it to the one that you love the best. Faster. Little Sally Walker, sitting on a saucer. Ride, Sally ride. Wipe your weeping eyes. Put your hands on your hips and let your back bone slip. Now, shake it to the east. Now, shake it to the west. Now, shake it to the one that you love the best. Better. Better. [ Applause ] If you dance like that, now they're probably going to throw you in prison. >> Susan Galbraith: That was okay. What else do you know? >> Roz White: We ready to do a recording yet? >> Susan Galbraith: Not yet. Sing me the oldest song you know. >> Roz White: How do I know how old the song is? >> Susan Galbraith: Well, if your grandmother said she learned a song from her grandmother, and maybe her grandmother before that. >> Roz White: I wouldn't know about that. >> Susan Galbraith: I think you do. I think you knew who I was before you came in here. I think you sang that song, Down on Me, knowing I'd hear it, knowing I'd like it, and knowing I'd invite you in here. And you've been sizing me up ever since you came. I think you're trying to decide how to play me. >> Roz White: Well, you think wrong, ma'am. >> Susan Galbraith: Then at least give me a song with more me on it. >> Roz White: Me? >> Susan Galbraith: Pain. You know something about pain? >> Roz White: Yes, I must. O, Lord now, trouble so hard. O, Lord, trouble so hard. Don't nobody know my troubles but God. Don't nobody know my troubles but God. It isn't new. Didn't stay long. Looked on the bed my mother was do. O, Lord now, trouble so hard. O, Lord, trouble so hard. Don't nobody know my trouble but God. Don't nobody know my trouble but God. When in the room, didn't stay long. Looked on the bed my child was there. O, Lord now, trouble so hard. O, Lord, trouble so hard. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: I guess I better get some men to lug in that recording machine. >> Roz White: Not yet. Only way I make a recording for you is if you look up an address for me in Houston. >> Susan Galbraith: Drive all the way to Houston and ask people who don't want to talk to me? >> Roz White: If you want songs. >> Susan Galbraith: Look, don't be silly. Here, I'll get you a dollar to record that song. >> Roz White: Keep it. >> Susan Galbraith: Three dollars. >> Roz White: You could pay me 30 pieces of silver, and I'd still say no. Now, do you want songs or not? >> Susan Galbraith: Okay, I'll do it, Ms. Johnson. >> Roz White: Call me Pearl. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: We're going to do another scene from Act 2, Scene 1, and this takes place in New York City. And actually, what has happened before this is Pearl Johnson does indeed let us know that she knows a song all the way back to Africa, but she doesn't give it to Susannah. Susannah does go and look for Pearl's daughter, and Pearl gets recorded, nonetheless. And the two women, spending time together, actually take the train up to New York because Susannah gets a parole for Pearl Johnson, and they go up to sing at Cooper Union on the behest of Carnegie Foundation. So, this Act 2, Scene 1 takes place in New York City. The lights come in on a Greenwich Village apartment as Susannah and Pearl enter with their bags. Pearl, who's never been so cold, has a scarf around her neck. And right about where you're sitting, ma'am, imagine a large carved African head statue right there, and a bowl of fruit is out on a table with a telegram. Oh, you'll get warm in no time. A bedroom is back there with a bathroom off of it. >> Roz White: Mercy. You sure your friend don't mind me staying here? >> Susan Galbraith: She insisted. And she won't be we won't be overcrowded. She's staying with some friend. >> Roz White: No, that ain't right. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, nonsense. She's a do gooder. But rule one, when do gooders want to do you a favor, let them. >> Roz White: This do gooder got an African head? >> Susan Galbraith: She got that in the Congo. Do you like it? >> Roz White: It's not real, right? >> Susan Galbraith: It's art. Not a trophy. >> Roz White: So, do Africans got white people heads in their room? >> Susan Galbraith: I wouldn't know. >> Roz White: I need a nap. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, no, no, no. I'll sleep on the couch. You get the bedroom. >> Roz White: Your friend don't mind somebody colored sleeping in her bed? >> Susan Galbraith: This is Greenwich Village. She's a bohemian. >> Roz White: We don't got that word in Texas. >> Susan Galbraith: Bohemians? They want to be artistic, but they don't have talent. You sleeping in her bed makes the bed more special to her. >> Roz White: No. >> Susan Galbraith: We're in the artistic part of town. Right across the street is a famous house. >> Roz White: That thing? >> Susan Galbraith: A poet, Edna St. Vincent Millay, lives there. It's the narrowest house in New York. >> Roz White: How you know all this? >> Susan Galbraith: I lived here. This was my apartment. >> Roz White: You and your parents lived here? >> Susan Galbraith: No, no. They still live up by the park. I moved in here after college. >> Roz White: Your parents going to come to our show? >> Susan Galbraith: No. >> Roz White: Why not? >> Susan Galbraith: That house, you can stand in the center and reach your arms out and almost touch the walls. >> Roz White: On the island, we had cabins only that wide. They got mistook by outsiders for big outhouses. [ Laughter ] >> Susan Galbraith: That's good. Mention that tonight. In fact, you should say more about the island than Texas. Your oldest songs come from there, and the island's got this exotic name. Nobody's ever heard of it. Hilton Head. >> Roz White: Nap time. >> Susan Galbraith: Wait. Hey, telegram. Oh, this is from the other woman who works with the library. I wrote her about your daughter and Hilton Head. She's changed her plans. Well, she sent this from Savannah. She's taking a boat to the island tomorrow. She'll look up your sister first thing. >> Roz White: Well, hallelujah. >> Susan Galbraith: Who knows? Your daughter could have reached the island by now, huh? >> Roz White: That'd make it easy for me to go to sleep. >> Susan Galbraith: She says, since she'll be there anyway, she might as well do some song collecting herself. Well, thank you, Zora Neale Hurston. Pearl, let's rehearse. >> Roz White: We do that on the train. >> Susan Galbraith: Another time won't hurt. >> Roz White: Did that telegram change things for you? >> Susan Galbraith: No. >> Roz White: Seemed like it. >> Susan Galbraith: No, we got here first. But just in case, we need to be perfect. So, we'll start with a slavery song from the island. >> Roz White: Little Sally Walker. >> Susan Galbraith: And then we'll talk about names. Pearl, tell us how many of the people in Hilton Head got their names. >> Roz White: Lots of folks named their children after something important to them. I had an auntie named after the biggest crop her father had, Okra. >> Susan Galbraith: And so it is, four people living close to nature. >> Roz White: So, my husband hates that. How does somebody name their child Okra? I think it's the old days. Old days is wrong. What if we have twins? What you going to name them, Biscuit and Gravy? [ Laughter ] >> Susan Galbraith: Can we just stick to the script? And tell us, Pearl, how did you decide to give your daughter a special name? >> Roz White: We give her a name so she know how unique she is. Uniqua. >> Susan Galbraith: Oppressed people often have nothing but their names to remind them of who they are. >> Roz White: Why would somebody of color name their child Uniqua as folklore? Is your name folklore too? >> Susan Galbraith: It's not >> Roz White: Your mama named you Susannah instead of Susan. >> Susan Galbraith: No, no, it's not part of the show. >> Roz White: Should be. What if we did a show in Africa? Maybe, maybe this guy want to know why white people name their children Bob. >> Susan Galbraith: It's stupid. My mother named me for the song, Oh Susanna. >> Roz White: You think your life would have been easy if you was Okra? >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl. >> Roz White: My people name their children after something to help them survive. Maybe your mama named you Susanna after a song to help her survive. >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl. >> Roz White: Maybe when she say Susanna, that would be her way of singing. Maybe we should invite her to the show and ask her. >> Susan Galbraith: Back to the script. Or else, look, we're going to screw up the show, and everything we've worked for will be for nothing. >> Roz White: You mean if I don't do things right, they don't like me? >> Susan Galbraith: There's a way to present things to people. >> Roz White: So, there is a chance they don't like me. We make a mistake coming here. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, no, no. >> Roz White: Well, why should they like me? There's nobody in New York that sings? >> Susan Galbraith: Not the songs you know. >> Roz White: But, well, what about my trouble? They're going to be put off by prison. >> Susan Galbraith: They love that you were in prison. The program tonight is sponsored by the Radical Women of the Historical Society. They call it Herstorical [phonetic]. She sings authentic songs and she cut off a pecker. Perfect. >> Roz White: Cutting off a pecker is easy. I'm sure there's some woman in here in New York that you cut off a pecker and sing. Why she not here? >> Susan Galbraith: Because she's not authentic. Nothing in New York is. It used to be, but then it came here and became something else. >> Roz White: No, the white people in Texas never cared about this stuff. These people won't either. >> Susan Galbraith: You're wrong. >> Roz White: No, no, no, no. We should you don't tell me I'm wrong. I know what white people think about colored people better than you do. >> Susan Galbraith: You are just having stage fright. >> Roz White: No, no, those people, you tell them call them and tell them we're not coming. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, no. >> Roz White: Tell them I'm sick. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, no. >> Roz White: Tell them whatever. >> Susan Galbraith: No! >> Roz White: Just tell them we're canceling. >> Susan Galbraith: No, we're not canceling! >> Roz White: Yes, ma'am. >> Susan Galbraith: Don't yes, ma'am me. I'm trying to help. >> Roz White: So was Jesus, but he didn't shout the Sermon on the Mount. [ Laughter ] >> Susan Galbraith: His audience wasn't trying to cancel the show. Pearl. >> Roz White: I don't care to hear you talk for a while, thank you. >> Susan Galbraith: You like fruit, right? You didn't see any for 10 years. So, here. Dig in. >> Roz White: It's because of berries I meet the man I married. Back when, back on the island when Thomas was a boy, his father sent him out with a wagon to sell. He used the fruit to flirt with all the females. I got blackberries, fresh and fine. I got blackberries, lady, fresh from the vine. I got blackberries, lady, two pound for a dime. I got anything you need. I'm a got em man. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: That's good. Oh, if I'm allowed to speak. Tell me more about him. >> Roz White: That man, even as a boy, he bragged. I'm going to jot down, turn around, pick up a bale of cotton. I say, "boy, you can't pick no bale a day. Nobody can. You just lie." Then he told me he wasn't going to be no cotton picker. He was going to run away, see the world, be a pullman porter on the biggest train in the country. He say, "that train's so big. To make it took the biggest steel mill in this country two year working on a 36 hour day and a 9 day week." I say, "boy, you lie." He say, "that train got a car. That train got so low that when the conductor go to take the tickets, he got to ride up and down the aisle on a motorcycle. That train so fast, when it comes to a stop, it's still going 50 mile an hour." He did leave. He did become a pullman porter. I was sure I'd never see him again. When I'd be churning butter, there was a little song I used to sing. The milk's in the pitcher. The butter's in the bowl. You can't catch a sweetheart to save your soul. >> Susan Galbraith: Let's put your husband in the show. His call, his story, and the song you sang about him churning while you churn the butter. >> Roz White: You'd do that for me? >> Susan Galbraith: We'll make a show that will become so famous that even if your daughter is not on the island, she'll hear about you and she'll come find you. >> Roz White: That sound good. >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl, sometimes I can be a little overbearing. >> Roz White: Mhmm. >> Susan Galbraith: But I know what I'm doing. We didn't get here by accident. The show will go well. So, can you trust me? Hmm? >> Roz White: Yes, Susannah. [ Applause ] >> Susan Galbraith: When the actors step up to the apron and bump right into the Cooper Union scene, the lights change and the sound of an audience applauding is heard. [ Applause ] Thank you! For the final song of the night, we've chosen one that was composed after the Civil War. Its author is lost to history, and the song was almost lost as well. But thanks to Paul, the song and the people the song is about live on. And thanks to the Carnegie Foundation's grant to the library. It will live forever. >> Roz White: So, would you like to help out on the sideline? >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl, some of us here are educated, right? >> Roz White: Who? >> Susan Galbraith: Stuffy folk who might not want to sing. >> Roz White: Oh, you'll be fine. Now, I need you folks on a song. So, when I point, you sing in a low voice, many thousand gone. Let's try that. >> Many thousand gone. >> Roz White: That was beautiful. But, let's try that again. Many thousand gone. Better, better. Here we go. Ms. Susannah? [ Laughter ] No more auction block for me. No more, no more, no more auction block for me. Many thousand gone. Again. Many thousand gone. No more driver's lash for me. No more, no more, no more driver's lash for me. Many thousand gone. Many thousand gone. Oh, no more master's call for me. No more, no more, no more master's call for me. Many thousand gone. Many thousand gone. Oh, no more, no more slavery chains for me. No more, no more, no more slavery chains for me. Many thousand gone. Many thousand gone. One more time. Many thousand gone. >> Susan Galbraith: Thank you for inviting us. >> Roz White: Let's do another one! >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl, as my mother used to say, when you go to a party, leave too soon. >> Roz White: And as my mama taught me, don't hide your light under a bushel. Now, in Hilton Head, we don't call the church a church. It be a praise house. And you all's voices be good enough to fit right in. >> Susan Galbraith: No, no, maybe not everyone here is religious. >> Roz White: Don't have to be. Just sing. [ Inaudible ] And we got a hat we passing around. >> Susan Galbraith: Oh, no, no, no. No, no. We don't, we don't pass a hat. It doesn't look professional. >> Roz White: But I'm not a professional. The whole reason I'm here is because I'm an amateur. Of course, the ark was built my amateurs. The Titanic was built by professionals. >> Susan Galbraith: Pearl, no, no. [ Laughter ] >> Roz White: Now, you going to sing these words in a low voice, but you're going to go up like this. Kumbaya. Let's try that. Kumbaya. And then you going to go back down. Kumbaya. Everybody. Kumbaya. Good. Okay, it's kumbaya, Lord. Kumbaya. It's kumbaya, Lord. Kumbaya. It's kumbaya, Lord. Kumbaya. Oh, Lord, kumbaya. My mother needs you, Lord. Kumbaya. My mother needs you, Lord. Kumbaya. My father needs you, Lord. Kumbaya. Oh, Lord, kumbaya. We need you. We need you, Lord. Kumbaya. We need you. We need you, Lord. Kumbaya. We need you. We need you, Lord. Kumbaya. Oh, Lord, kumbaya. Now you chant. Kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya, kumbaya. One more time. Kumbaya, kumbaya. You're good. [ Applause ] >> NJ Mitchell: Okay, Library of Congress community. You have just become family, you know? Turning around in this cozy space and listening to both of these scenes. We've got a couple of questions that you can help us with. We're in the process of this production. And we'll be putting on the full production, but sharing these two scenes with you is very important to us for feedback. We'd like to get your feedback. So, my first question is, why, why do you think Susannah works so hard to get Pearl out of jail? Why do you think? Why do you think she works so hard to get her out of jail? >> Susan Galbraith: And I travel all over, which you didn't hear. But I travel all over to find her daughter after first, just meeting her. >> NJ Mitchell: Yes, ma'am? >> I have a >> NJ Mitchell: Oh, we're going to pass the mic. >> So, this is for the recording. >> I think she found potential in Pearl and she sort of liked her and was thinking that this could be somebody who can make it in the world. >> NJ Mitchell: Could everybody hear that? >> So, the mics are not amplified. And NJ, I think you need to >> NJ Mitchell: Okay, everybody heard that? That's okay. [ Inaudible ] Okay, the mics, the, your answers are not amplified. It's just for the video recording. So, I'll repeat the answers. So, could you say that one more time? >> I think that Susannah saw potential in Pearl and she wanted to really help her to make it in life. >> NJ Mitchell: Okay, she saw potential in Pearl and wanted to try to help her make it in life. But why do you think that she did? Anybody? Yes? >> Hang on. Just one second. Sorry. [ Inaudible ] >> I think Susannah found a profession that she really loved and was really deeply motivated by her desire to bring authentic culture to the world. And she gradually realized that she had not only found what she was looking for, but it was had this dual purpose of making her life better, as well as really accomplishing what she set out to do. >> NJ Mitchell: She really found a pearl, huh? >> She, she, yeah, she got it. It took her a little bit. >> NJ Mitchell: Thank you so much. Anybody else? >> I think Susannah started out to be kind of imperious and not particularly friendly to Pearl because she has an ego, and her ego needs to be satisfied by finding a pearl to become her emblem of her professional success. >> NJ Mitchell: Yeah, so that leads me to another question. So, did Pearl help out did everybody hear that response? So, how do you think that Pearl helped out with helping Susannah make that transition? Because Susannah did come in kind of high horse. Does everybody agree? You know, she's bringing something to the prison for Pearl. And so, how did Pearl help with Susannah kind of a bit, coming down a little bit off of the horse? Yes, ma'am? >> Pearl had her own dignity, and wasn't going to let her walk over her. >> Let Susannah walk over her. >> NJ Mitchell: Pearl had her own self. She may be in prison, but she was not in prison. Did you take that from her? Her performance, that she really holds on to herself? Anybody else? Okay, family. What do you think, what do you see in the play? Let's look at this one. What do you see in the play are the issues that are being brought out with "Black Pearl Sing?" What are some of the issues that you see in the play? Oh, love it. >> Speaking as a self exiled former New Yorker, I can relate. I see there is always a search for, you know, oh, we need the next new thing, the next exotic thing, and that quickly passes and moves on. And so there is this dynamic intention, I think, between Susannah and Pearl about when Pearl says, "well, they're not going to like me," well, this is, you know, maybe exotic now, but is Susanne really interested in Pearl's growth and, you know, her future, or is this just the exotic thing for now? >> NJ Mitchell: Interesting. I love the question that Pearl puts back at Susanne and says to her, "you think there's a chance they won't like me?" >> Yeah. >> NJ Mitchell: Good. Thank you. Thank you so much for sharing. >> So, I'll stand when I speak. But I see issues of exploitation. And this reminds me of Imitation of Life with Claudette Colbert when she goes to the black woman who works for her and says, "I'm doing this pancake thing, and you get 20%." But it was the black woman's recipe. So, I see those kind of issues there. >> NJ Mitchell: Oh, wonderful. Thank you. We have one here. >> Can I just go farther with that? If exploitation, and I don't mean to jump in, but I'm curious, as many of you, or all of you may, in fact, work for the Library of Congress, so how do you field questions like this about your own collections? >> NJ Mitchell: That was my next question. >> Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry. >> NJ Mitchell: But hold that question in mind, because it does, that does pull from your response. And I want that question answered. But I wanted to give you a chance. >> Yeah, what I really liked was the way it addresses the correlation or connection between the races. You know, if white folks say, oh, now I got it, now I understand, no, they never do. And for me, for me to get that is I feel like that if guys tell me how women feel. I say, no, you never do. And I think we should keep that in mind and say, okay, we leave each other in that particular room, treat each other fairly, but never be so elegant to say, uh huh, now I know. >> NJ Mitchell: I just love that. I love that response. And June, I love, I love your response. I think that's answered with Pearl saying, you know, okay, let's talk money first thing, you know? She put it with the money. Say, well, you know, let me hear your song, you know, let me see what you've got first, you know? So, all are great questions. Now onto the big one of how you handle things with, what do you think from the perspective of the Library of Congress, and how you collect information. Anyone want to be brave? Anyone want to be brave? I'm sure that when you, you're collecting information and resources that are at the heart of people, that's what the Library of Congress is. >> I can speak to I'm a reference librarian at the Folklife Center. And I curate the Lomax material. And so, yeah. So, that [inaudible] story that you're telling has roots in two 19th century people trying to exist in the early 20th century. And exploitation, absolutely, yes, in the scene that you're talking about. John Lomax wanted to exploit Huddie Ledbetter because he wanted fame himself. Now, Leadbelly wanted fame as well. He was a well known performer in his area. So, he went in with eyes open. Today, we have to be respectful in the term that we use, intellectual property rights. And anytime that we have a question about, well, can I use this recording that was made in the prison, we tell people about that, that that recording is not free. That recording belongs to that person. And it belongs to their heirs. And so we do our very best to be good stewards of the material. It's not easy because we're dealing with a lot of people who didn't leave a forwarding address. And we don't know how to find their families. But we do a very we do our very best to respect the intellectual property rights. Is that helpful? >> Susan Galbraith: Yeah. Yeah. Yep. >> I actually, my job here is to select the free material that comes into the Library of Congress. That's actually my job. And one of the things about our collections that a lot of people, even people who work here don't understand, there is a variety of collection quality statements over various topics. And it's on us to make sure we understand what's coming in here, why we're taking it, and making sure we are stewards of it, and making it available now and in the future. And I think that, you know, as he was saying with the intellectual property rights, I used to work in a copyright office. That's their job as well, is to make sure this material is being, being, well, we do the archiving, we do the protecting, but they're also making sure that people know who owns this material. That's actually something that they're actually trying to work on from a legal perspective. That's a big issue right now is trying to make sure that people who are out there I'm also a lawyer. That's why I know this. The reason why, you know, if there is a, an ownership issue, to try and get that information to the copyright office so they can reconcile it, so reference librarians can say, oh, you need to contact these people to use this in this film. That's the whole point of that. So, you know, as you talk to these people, let them know, if they know information about pieces, we try and do that as we do now. But the material that we're getting in now, we make it a point to try and be as inclusive within our collection policy guidelines as possible. So, we're getting that material. We're making it a point to make sure that we take care of it and preserve it for the future. >> NJ Mitchell: Beautiful, beautiful. Anybody else? >> I think it's interesting. I think it's important and obvious to point out that you, of course, are dealing with a different era, when all of these things weren't the case. And so I think it's an important story to tell, how things came to be collected. I think it is a wonderful story where we are moving to, an awareness that exists in the world now, and in cultural heritage institutions, to be able to look back at these materials that were collected in a different way and treat them differently and handle them differently. >> Susan Galbraith: But might have been lost. >> Yeah, it's amazing that we still have the stories, right? >> And that we curate them differently, and they think about them differently, and apply these new principles and values and rules. >> NJ Mitchell: Excellent. I want to move you back to the excerpts of plays. And I want to give you an opportunity to speak to Susanne or to speak to Pearl. What would you say? What would you say in the event that they have shared with you and these two excerpts? What would you want to say to Susanne or Pearl? Yes, ma'am? >> I would have a question for Susanne. I would have a question for Susanne, and that question is about why be dismissive of Zora Neale Hurston? >> Susan Galbraith: Because I think I'm jealous. >> And it even comes out in the delivery of that line, you know? She kind of throws it, you know? [ Inaudible ] >> I have a question for, is it Susanne or Susannah? >> Susan Galbraith: Susannah. Susannah. >> My question is, I noticed Pearl asked you several times about your mother and your family. Do you not feel like you have any rich tradition or culture in your life like Pearl has that you want to share? Every time she asks you, you shied away from it. And I feel like what she was sharing was so rich and deep and deep in her tradition, but it seemed like you dismissed that in yourself. Either you didn't have it, you don't know about it, your parents didn't share it with you, and I find that very sad. And I was wondering about that. >> Susan Galbraith: Well, that's a really good question. Know that this is the beginning of my journey with this play. So, I'm trying to excavate some of these things that are left as clues, but are not totally, you know, spelled out for Susannah. Now, you didn't see the whole play. We chose the scenes that we thought had particular meat. The director chose these two scenes because he felt that they spoke to the Library of Congress in terms of the setup and so on. But some of the other scenes go into their growing relationship more, and how she's able to get out of me more information. I'm able to get out of her more information, particularly around her daughter. And that so, there's a big character in here who's never on stage, right, which is the daughter. And I guess bonds them, to some extent. And so on. But there are other things that happen about me. One of the interesting things is I wanted a place at Harvard. And the material that I got in the field was stolen by a male. Never happens. Who got the job at Harvard. So, there's that, again, spoken about. There's some more about my family who obviously are wealthy and wanted me to have a more traditional life. A girl, a young woman, or not so young woman getting on a train and sitting in the colored car with, you know, traveling into prisons was not something my family was probably very pleased about. I think there are other things also implied, but I'm still trying to find that out. What did you think? What do you think might be her secrets? >> I think that maybe she is ashamed that she doesn't have any rich traditions to pass on, whether it's songs or culture or, you know, memories of grandparents and stories and folklore and, you know, all of that stuff. I'm just, I don't know, I haven't seen the whole thing. >> Susan Galbraith: Hopeful. Yes, thank you. Thank you very much. [ Inaudible ] >> I just wanted to say that what you gave us, Susannah, in the play about your parents just made me think that possibly a combination. They hate what you do and they hate the idea of you associating with people of color. And the fact that you just like wouldn't go near it was like, I'm not going there, not going there. >> Susan Galbraith: Uh huh. Well, they live in the park, right? >> Pearl, what happened to your daughter? Why is it that you can't find your daughter? >> NJ Mitchell: Well, why have you not like what happened to your daughter? Why have you not been able to find your daughter? >> Roz White: It's a combination of things. Lack of technology, because, you know, it's harder through letters, and then she's been in prison for 10 years. So, the daughter has grown up basically without her mother. And so she's, in that growing up, she's, you know, probably found a man, and, you know, that's taken her away from where her mother can get to her. And then some people on the island don't read and don't write letters, and so they're not keeping her informed. And also, her going to prison has kind of excommunicated her in a way. You know, even though the reason that she goes to prison is for, the only reason you should ever go to prison, which is somebody is trying to harm your child, or harming your child. And so I kind of said, okay, I mean, listen, I'll take the 10 years because that person will never hurt anybody again because they're gone. But, yeah, so, she so, that's why she can't find her. It's been 10 years. Some people on the island don't read or write. And so things have just been lost. And so what it taught me is that, you know, A, I'm very, very fortunate to be living in the time that I'm living in. But it also, I think the relationship this piece is very special to me simply because I am a performer who performs things that I create myself. And it took me not getting the exposure or the work that I thought I should be getting to decide to do that. I was like, I've got to stop waiting for somebody else to say yes or no to my life. So, I need to write my own stuff. But just rig your own stuff is not enough. Every Pearl needs a Susannah, or several Susannahs. And so we help each other. And so just like Susannah says, people who cook meals and pick cotton have a lot to do with the fabric of how this country works. And so to my to the young lady who spoke about the secrets that they may have, everybody has a role. And so the less we are ashamed of being the meal cooker or cotton picker, the more we can communicate those things to each other so that we all become richer for it. That's what I learned from the piece. [ Applause ] >> To Pearl, at the end of the play, after the evolution of these two characters together, for what kind of things would you trust Susannah, for what kind of things would you not trust Susannah? >> Roz White: That's a good question, and I can't say everything without completely revealing what happens in the play. But what I will say is that there's a much bigger picture that Pearl has in mind. And it's not even about what I'm not going to trust Susannah with. It is the bigger picture of how we have to preserve our history. And everybody has their own way of doing it. So, just like the descendants of Pearl who now can read and write, have a different way of telling it, it had to start somewhere. And so for me, as a storyteller, as, you know, a griot, the oral tradition should never be overlooked. It should never be overlooked. And it should never be done away with. We have to keep talking. Because, remember, if I tell the story, and then my sister tells the story, you're probably going to get two different stories. Some of the same facts are in the story. But it's just, you know, so that's what I think, you know, I discover at the end is that there's some things that I can give, but there are some things that I have to hold on to. [ Inaudible ] >> You know, the importance of preserving our stories, and for me, the importance of who gets to tell the story, is always been the core of what we should think about when we are translating information like Pearl just said. So, I was expecting to hear that from you guys. >> Roz White: Can I, can I ask? So, just as an artist, I think that there's a bigger story that is within the story in that when an artist discovers that they're an artist, and I think that the turning point is, because we all, you know, we see that Pearl knows songs from when she was a child, and that her mom taught her as a child, but there's something different about just singing, you know, songs in play with your mom or out, yet we did cheers when I was a young person, and we'd be out, you know, and my grandma used to yell up to us. [ Inaudible ] But it was our way of carrying on that tradition of some of the work songs. And we changed them. They were a little sassy, you know? But, so, I just think that the big story is in these two women discovering what their real destiny is and being okay with it not necessarily meaning that everything is going to be always great. Like there's a lot of pain in both of their lives. And how do you move on from that pain? And how do you use the pain? Because great art is often born of great pain. And so how do we make peace with that, and, you know, not seek out pain, but just make sure that we are connected and don't become numb? So, yeah. >> Susan Galbraith: If I can pick up on something else you said, Roz, one of the reasons that we're doing this project is something else that you said, which is the whole idea of how do we get, you know, young people, the next generation, to really own and shape and respond to these stories in music? And I work part of the time in China in an area that basically has no culture. That's unfair to say, perhaps. But it's Shenzhen. So, they bulldozed a mountain range and they put up a free trade zone. And so people came from all over China, but there was no interest really. There was no local culture because everybody came from other places. Now there is an interest in getting young people. And the young Chinese have no interest in traditional Chinese culture. None. And then, of course, with the, you know, excesses and problems of the cultural revolution and so on. So, we're starting to work with Roz also teaches at Duke Ellington. We are going to be working with some students at Duke Ellington to shape and design a workshop. And we're going to be working with John Fenn and other members of the Library of Congress to help these students. We're calling it content and practice, with the idea that they're learning how to research, themselves research and go into something. Not waiting for other people to tell them what to sing and what to do, but really finding out what their voice connects with. And then being able to get the tools and use your wonderful primary resources to then make their own event story, song, whatever. [ Inaudible ] That's really what our company is about. [ Applause ] This is a catalyst for that. >> This is just something I learned this morning. I'm not with the Library of Congress, but I did do a workshop this morning about using materials from the Library of Congress for genealogy. And I learned something amazing to me, which is that the fellow who gave this workshop, who's African American, asked the question, what group do you think has the greatest number of inquiries about genealogy to the Library of Congress? There were a lot of answers in the room, but none of them was the right answer. The right answer is prisoners. And he pointed out that one of the reasons, he believes, that that's so is because once you are stripped of your rights, it becomes much more important to learn about your heritage. I just offer that because I learned it this morning. >> Susan Galbraith: Thank you. A Pearl. Another Pearl. [ Inaudible ] >> NJ Mitchell: Wow, that's very interesting. Thank you so much. [ Inaudible ] >> This is just a comment. It's not really a question. I've been in your position, the two of you, in my life, another part of my life. And the scene that in which you are teaching Susannah how to do "Little Sally Walker," I've seen that kind of scene over and over again. And what happens often is that the person playing Susannah's role doesn't really understand the integrity of the song and the movements, and doesn't really thinks that, oh, well, if I can't do this easily, it's not that I need a whole lot of practice to learn how to do it, it's I can change it. So, it's not respecting the fact that there's a right way to do it. And not every way is right. And the artistic integrity, the honor of the tradition, and that's a very important point, I think, to bring out even more strongly in this play. I've heard people say, "oh, well, I'll just change it into a march." Because they can easily do a march. But they're not really respecting, or even understanding what that tradition you would never change if you were doing a string quartet, say, "oh, well, I'll change, you know, I'll change it into a rock song, because that's what I can do." So, I would just encourage you to work, to work to make sure that what comes out to the audience is that the traditions have integrity. They need to be respected for what they are. And that they are important. And because they're not what society would say is quote the high form doesn't, I mean, that's the tension there. >> NJ Mitchell: Thank you so much. That's a wonderful note to end on. Thank you, Library of Congress family. >> Susan Galbraith: Thank you very much. Thank you.